On 14.09.2007 18:36, Jeff Spaleta wrote:
On 9/14/07, Thorsten Leemhuis <fedora(a)leemhuis.info> wrote:
> (¹) -- No, I'm don't have a problem with calling a decision of mine
> "totally stupid" (I sometimes do myself). But I think it's not helpful
> when done in public.
> IOW: This IMHO is just another occurrence that confirms by impression
> that "the tone on the fedora lists IMHO gets worse and worse" (²) --
> that's IMHO bad as it might be deterring to new developers or lurkers on
> the list that might fear hard words more then we do.
I think i this case we can put the blame completely on Jeremy. So its
perfectly fair to say that Jeremy was totally stupid.... and you were
just an innocent victim of his masterful power of persuasion.
It wasn't his decision alon and I backed the idea ;-)
When I handed over the package to someone else I even said explicit:
don't remove that stuff!
But as I said: I can live with being called "totally stupid" -- I'm
around long enough and got used to it.
> /me always wonders if people on a party or a conference would go to the
> podium and say "foo is totally stupid" if the chance that the one that
> is responsible for "foo" is in the auditorium
Actually a statement like that to open up a conference presentation is
a great way to have the audience pay attention. [...]
Hehe, yeah, I suppose it would.
I think people on the lists communicate by and large exactly how
would communicate in any established small working group settings...
say for example the 4th lab group assignment in a college course. Not
the first assignment, at the beginning of the class when people don't
really know each other yet. But the fourth assignment, after the group
members have pretty much gained an intuitive feel for the personality
quirks of the rest of the group. Except on the lists, you're
interacting with people you haven't actually had enough face-to-face
time with to get an accurate intuitive feel for them so its much
easier to cross the line from passionated impersonal discussion into
personal offense without ever knowing you crossed it.
Fully agreed. I'd even would like to add something: In this "college
course" (aka this list) there are constantly new people watching from
the side if they should join the never-ending-course. And that's what we
want IMHO: join us, help us. But if you would look for a area to jum in
and watch a course where people are rude or unfriendly to each other
without need: would you join it or look out for another (friendlier) course?