desktop March 2007

desktop@lists.fedoraproject.org

21 participants
16 discussions

install pam_keyring by default in the GNOME based live cd?
by Rahul Sundaram 01 Jun '07

01 Jun '07

Hi "PAM_KEYRING is a pam module that launches the gnome-keyring-daemon and then unlocks a keyring using your login password." http://www.hekanetworks.com/index.php/publisher/articleview/frmArticleID/25… Rahul

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KDE-Live-CD: basic cd layout and localizations
by Sebastian Vahl 30 Mar '07

30 Mar '07

Hi. I've created a new basic layout for the cd: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/FeatureFedoraKDE/KDELiveCD The size on todays rawhide is about 667 MB. Please tell me which package should be added or removed. On todays KDE-SIG-Meeting Rex Dieter and Kevin Kofler suggested to give the local communities the ability to create their own localized cds easily. To do this there should be an extra configuration file for each language which adds the needed packages and do some configurations. And also the additional language must fit on one cd. A second option for localized versions could (or should?) be a live-dvd with all available language packages. livecd-creator in git seems to be able to do this (but I haven't checked this yet). [1] I've created a first draft for an configuration for the german language. This adds kde-i18n-de and koffice-langpack-de to the cd. Also the standard keyboard layout, the local timezone and the locale is changed. To change the keyboard layout inside kde I've used an ugly workaround.[2] If anybody knows a better way, please tell me. :) Compared to the version above this one needs ~675 MB. To create the configuration files for different languages I need some informations from one person that uses the language: 1. /etc/sysconfig/i18n 2. /etc/sysconfig/keyboard 3. /etc/sysconfig/clock 4. keybordtype from "system-config-keyboard --help" 5. needed additional packages (eg. scim-* or fonts-*) And of course all are invited to discuss this. :) Sebastian [1] http://git.fedoraproject.org/?p=hosted/livecd [2] http://www.deadbabylon.de/fedora/livecd/source/50-fedora-livecd-kde-german.… ######### How to create the live cd: Install livecd-tools: wget "http://people.redhat.com/~katzj/live/f7test2/livecd-tools-001-3.fc7.i386.rpm" rpm -ivh livecd-tools-001-3.fc7.i386.rpm Create the spin: livecd-creator \ --repo=c7,http://download.fedora.redhat.com/pub/fedora/linux/core/development/i386/os/Fedora/RPMS/ \ --repo=e7,http://download.fedora.redhat.com/pub/fedora/linux/extras/development/i386/ \ --repo=lcd7,http://www.deadbabylon.de/fedora/livecd/i386/ \ --package=fedora-livecd-kde \ --fslabel=Fedora-7-Test2-KDE To create the german version: livecd-creator \ --repo=c7,http://download.fedora.redhat.com/pub/fedora/linux/core/development/i386/os/Fedora/RPMS/ \ --repo=e7,http://download.fedora.redhat.com/pub/fedora/linux/extras/development/i386/ \ --repo=lcd7,http://www.deadbabylon.de/fedora/livecd/i386/ \ --package=fedora-livecd-kde-german \ --fslabel=Fedora-7-Test2-KDE-German

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Re: Compiz Integration
by Matthias Clasen 30 Mar '07

30 Mar '07

On Wed, 2007-03-28 at 21:22 -0400, Kristian Høgsberg wrote: > > I added the appearance, the workspace and the above patches from the GNOME > bugzilla locally and from a quick look-through they seem OK and they work > pretty well. I'm not sure if we wan't to add this stuff after the FC7 feature > freeze - Matthias? If they work thats fine with me. Wrt. to the ABOVE patch note that I sent mail to the wm-spec list to get _NET_WM_ACTION_ABOVE/BELOW added to the EWMH.

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Re: Compiz Integration
by drago01 29 Mar '07

29 Mar '07

Kristian Høgsberg wrote: > > Yup, saw that. Alright then, patches are go! Should be in rawhide > tomorrow. > :)

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Re: Compiz Integration
by drago01 29 Mar '07

29 Mar '07

Kristian Høgsberg wrote: > dragoran wrote: >> >> With fc6 compiz and AIGLX got into fedora and we should improve the >> user expirence with this in F7, not make it worse. >> We also need to integrate compiz better into our desktop. >> >> Right now its easy to active and to disable with the "Desktop >> Effects" app. >> But this does not work correctly due to some regressions. >> >> 1)Compiz gets started from the session manager and so its not >> possible to switch compiz->metacity because compiz restarts itself. > > I couldn't reproduce this, but it does look like compiz should > properly deregister itself. I sent a patch reply to your mail on the > compiz list, if you could try that out and see if it work that'd be > great. > ok I will test it but not today.. have some work that has to be finished by tomorrow :( >> 2)The next thing is that if compiz is configured to use 4 Viewports >> and Metacity 4 Workspaces compiz will ignore its own setting and use >> the metacity one until X is restarted. > > Yeah, I reproduced this and it's pretty confusing when you both have > workspace and viewports active. I'm not sure that feature is even in > compiz... it is... the cube does not work without viewports thats why because it has both now... > >> The god news are that this stuff is fixed, we only need to get the >> fixes into fedora ;) >> There is a patch for 1) in bugzilla: >> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=229113 >> As for 2) I have sent a patch upstream which is merged into current >> git. It adds a --ignore-desktop-hints commandline switch to compiz >> which fixes this behavior. We need to either make it the default by >> patching compiz or start compiz with this option from "Desktop >> Effects". ( I can send a patch for desktop-effects/compiz if needed) > > I'd rather not have to patch this - for our 0.3.6 RPM we'll probably > have to, but longer term I don't see why compiz would ever want to > have this behaviour. ok, then we should move this discussion upstream... look at this commit: http://gitweb.freedesktop.org/?p=xorg/app/compiz.git;a=commit;h=256882741ef… > >> After doing this the switching between metacity and compiz should >> work as fine as it did when fc6 got released. (The current f6 updates >> have the same problems). I am using a custom compiz package(git >> snapshot) with this changes and it works without any problems and is >> stable. (With compiz-0.3.6 the window decorator sometimes crashes but >> this is fixed in git; have not seen any crash with it). We have >> shipped a git snapshot in fc6 so this should not be the problem, also >> 0.4 should be out sometime soon. > > I haven't seen it crash when I've used it. Do you have an idea what > the fix is in upstream or could you try to get a backtrace of the crash? I don't know exactly what has fixed it upstream.. I will test it tomorrow again, and try to get a backtrace, the problem is that it isn't easy to reproduce, sometimes it happens after some minutes sometimes it works for hours with no problems. as for current git, it never happend for me... > When we shipped a git snapshot there wasn't an official release out > yet. I'd like to stick with 0.3.6 until 0.4 is released, and in any > case, we're not making that change for FC7 at this point. > ok but 0.4 should be out before F7 final so I hope this makes it in.

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Compiz Integration
by drago01 25 Mar '07

25 Mar '07

With fc6 compiz and AIGLX got into fedora and we should improve the user expirence with this in F7, not make it worse. We also need to integrate compiz better into our desktop. Right now its easy to active and to disable with the "Desktop Effects" app. But this does not work correctly due to some regressions. 1)Compiz gets started from the session manager and so its not possible to switch compiz->metacity because compiz restarts itself. 2)The next thing is that if compiz is configured to use 4 Viewports and Metacity 4 Workspaces compiz will ignore its own setting and use the metacity one until X is restarted. The god news are that this stuff is fixed, we only need to get the fixes into fedora ;) There is a patch for 1) in bugzilla: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=229113 As for 2) I have sent a patch upstream which is merged into current git. It adds a --ignore-desktop-hints commandline switch to compiz which fixes this behavior. We need to either make it the default by patching compiz or start compiz with this option from "Desktop Effects". ( I can send a patch for desktop-effects/compiz if needed) After doing this the switching between metacity and compiz should work as fine as it did when fc6 got released. (The current f6 updates have the same problems). I am using a custom compiz package(git snapshot) with this changes and it works without any problems and is stable. (With compiz-0.3.6 the window decorator sometimes crashes but this is fixed in git; have not seen any crash with it). We have shipped a git snapshot in fc6 so this should not be the problem, also 0.4 should be out sometime soon. The next thing is libwnck. Compiz supports the "Always on top" feature but it is not selectable in the menu because of a bug in libwnck. There is a patch for it in the gnome bugzilla: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=352383 The patch in question is the _NET_WM_STATE_ABOVE.patch we should get this into our libwnck package. We already have patches in libwnck and gnome-panel for compiz integration so it would not hurt to add this small patch too. There is also the viewport.patch in this bugzilla entry. I am not using this myself right now (so I can't comment on its stability) but we also should aim to get this patch in too. P.S: please don't start a compiz <> beryl flamewar

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Online Questionnaire on Gnome/KDE for my master thesis ... Online-Umfrage zu Gnome/KDE für meine Diplomarbeit
by Martin Neuwirth 22 Mar '07

22 Mar '07

Hello/Guten Tag! Read below the line with the many (---) signs for the german version of this mail. I am a student at the technical university of Vienna. I hope that you can help me out by taking part in my online questionnaire, which deals with usability aspects of the two biggest user interfaces Gnome and KDE for open source desktops. I am doing this research as a part of my theses in computer science. The questionnaire can be found at: http://www.schilf.at/gnomeKde/index.php?lang=en Even if you are not familiar with those terms right now your contribution is still of great value to me. Thank you for participating. (------------------------------------------------------------------) Ich bin Student an der Technischen Universität in Wien. Ich hoffe, dass du kurz Zeit hast und mir beim Herausfinden von Usabilityaspekten der beiden großen Benutzerschnittstellen Gnome und KDE behilflich sein kannst. Ich führe diese Umfrage im Rahmen meiner Diplomarbeit für Informatik durch und würde dich bitten unter folgendem Link: http://www.schilf.at/gnomeKde daran teilzunehmen. Auch wenn dir diese beiden Begriffe momentan unbekannt scheinen ist dein Beitrag wertvoll. Danke für deine Teilnahme. -- Martin Neuwirth -- Martin

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User Images
by Diana Fong 21 Mar '07

21 Mar '07

Hello All, I’d like to thank everyone for their submissions to the User Image Request. We received 67 submissions. Along with the images we already had and those from the User Pictures Project, this gave us a total of 223 images from which to choose. Needless to say, it was difficult to narrow these down to 24 default images, but here they are. [1] All 223 images will be packaged along with the release, but they can be found now at: [2] for the set of 24, [3] for extras, and [4] for the source files (warning 49.7M). I would encourage everyone to explore the others and find the one that works best for him/her. In addition, I hope that these will serve as inspiration for other submissions in the future. Thanks again to everyone for participating in this project. Contributors: Markg85 Ben Arnold John Baer Kay Bergemann Thomas Canniot Diana Fong Steven Garrity Dimitris Glezos Mike Langlie Jim Lawrence Garrett LeSage John W. Lockhart Maren Lockhart Jiri Jakub Masek Andreas Nilsson Jef Spaleta Jakub Steiner If I have missed anyone, I apologize. All the submissions and their contributor information can be found at GNOME-look.org (Content:Clipart, Name: UserImage - [name of submission]) and User Picture Project. All images are licensed as GPL. [1] http://www.isity.net/blog/wp-content/themes/default/images/pics/070319/024s… [2] http://people.redhat.com/dfong/userImages/faces.tar.gz [3] http://people.redhat.com/dfong/userImages/extras.tar.gz [4] http://people.redhat.com/dfong/userImages/user-image-source.tar.gz Diana Fong --- Red Hat Visual Designer

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application statistics
by Bryan Clark 14 Mar '07

14 Mar '07

Hey ~ So we've been collecting some application usage statistics [1] on mugshot for a little while now and it's starting to reveal some interesting (and obvious) stuff. You could look at evolution vs. thunderbird and firefox vs. epiphany or gossip vs. gaim. It's a bit hard to pull enough context into those comparisons to really get down to the reasons why some are used more than others but it's a good start so far. If you're not aware of the application statistics take a look the statistics page [1] as well as the recent blog entry [2] for some background. In a nutshell we've asked mugshot users anonymously share their application usage statistics in order to determine application popularity. Mugshot is cool and free and open to everyone [3], you can sign up today if any of this interests you. So now we're moving this application statistics idea on to a new phase and are looking for ideas. During our talk at FUDCon we showed a couple of mockups [4] of things we were possibly looking at doing. While we're still touching on most of the different areas shown there we now have a decent prototype for the statistical application usage information and it would be great to drive in that direction for a little while. We're looking into, as it was suggested on the blog, that we might provide correlations between usage such that you could see xterm users are more likely to run xmms. However there might be other correlations that would be good to show as well. Also we're trying to figure out how we can determine related applications. Mime types are a bit of a mess to try linking similar applications together so we might have to ask people to help edit the information wiki style. The application categorires are problematic for this as well. Right now there doesn't seem to be any existing information on how thunderbird, evolution, and balsa are all email clients. While our application pages don't always correspond directly to a project we've looked into providing doap [5] files for all of our application information. Because of the disconnect between application, package, and project this might not work out but it's certainly possible to provide some information in this format. As this mockup [6] suggests we're currently looking into how we could offer install links for applications thus giving a bit more of a application browse and download / install feel. The backend bits to this all use yum / pirut to handle the actual install. And we've also added a way to pull in more application description information as well. There's a little bit more information available on the app stats wiki page [7] if you still have general questions. Thanks, ~ Bryan [1] http://mugshot.org/applications [2] http://blog.mugshot.org/?p=353 [3] http://mugshot.org/signup [4] http://developer.mugshot.org/wiki/Category:FUDCon_Boston_2007 [5] http://usefulinc.com/doap/ [6] http://developer.mugshot.org/wiki/Image:Application_Statistics_Thunderbird_… [7] http://developer.mugshot.org/wiki/Application_Statistics

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Discussion about F7-KDE-LiveCD
by Sebastian Vahl 07 Mar '07

07 Mar '07

Hi! I want to start a discussion about the package list on a possible f7-kde-livecd. It would be much easier for me to test some configurations when the direction is cleared. :) So I've got some questions: 1. Configuration: Do we want (according to the gnome/desktop-livecd) a base configuration and an "advanced" configuration? Of course only one (the advanced) would be created and published. But having a standard configuration would it make easier to change some things. 2. Browser/Email: Do we want Firefox and/or Evolution on the live-cd? (Be aware that space is limited) 3. Do we want krusader and/or dolphin on the live-cd? In general: Do we want duplications in the functionality of applications (not as easy as it sounds; eg. amarok vs. noatun? 4. What about localisation? The kde-i18n-packages are not really slim. So perhaps putting them on a live-dvd would be the better idea (gnome/desktop-livecd is fully localized) ------ For comparison of sizes (the named packages are listed in 20-fedora-livecd-kde.conf and of course have dependencies): a) A suggested base cd has the size of ~474 MB (here on i386) Packages: chkconfig, xorg-x11-drivers, system-config-display, vim-minimal pirut, setroubleshoot, system-config-rootpassword, system-config-printer, alsa-utils, dejavu-lgc-fonts, arts, kdelibs, kdebase, kdeadmin, kdeaccessibility, kdeartwork, kdebindings, kdegraphics, kdenetwork, kdepim, knetworkmanager, k3b, kaffeine, kpowersave b) An "advanced" CD uses ~705 MB. Packages: as in a) plus: kdeartwork-icons, kdeedu, kdegames, kdetoys, kdeutils, akode, amarok, beryl-kde, cups, digikam, digikamimageplugins, gnupg2, gpgme, gstreamer-plugins-base, gstreamer-plugins-good, gstreamer-tools, gtk-qt-engine, kmenu-gnome, koffice-suite, konversation, krusader, ktorrent, pinentry-qt, twinkle, taskjuggler, samba-client c) A localized cd with kde-i18n-* uses ~690MB. Packages: chkconfig, xorg-x11-drivers, system-config-display, vim-minimal, pirut, setroubleshoot, system-config-rootpassword, alsa-utils, dejavu-lgc-fonts, kdelibs, kdebase, arts, kdeaccessibility, kdeartwork, kdebindings, kdegraphics, kdenetwork, kdepim, knetworkmanager (I'm surely missed some usefull packages) --- So the steps for the next time should be: 1. Decide about the packages that should definitely be there (as base configuration (eg. kdenetwork: yes; kdegames: no) 2. Decide about the configuration for livecd-creator (eg. 20-fedora-livecd-kde.conf AND 30-fedora-livecd-kde-advanced.conf OR only one configuration) 3. Decide about the addon packages. Not all from http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/FeatureFedoraKDE/PackageList could be integrated into one cd. 4. Test the configurations on all archs (not sure if the size is the same on x86_64 or ppc). Of course, these things are all suggestions. :) Will be happy about some feedback Sebastian

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desktop March 2007