I was looking for a document that would explain how Linux/Fedora decides what driver to use with a given USB device, and google directed me to usb-hotplug-tutorial.
Unfortunately this appeared to be in XML, and required a DTD which I could not find.
Are these documents currently unreadable? If not, perhaps a link to an explanation of how to process them might be in order.
Uttered Timothy Murphy tim@birdsnest.maths.tcd.ie, spake thus:
I was looking for a document that would explain how Linux/Fedora decides what driver to use with a given USB device, and google directed me to usb-hotplug-tutorial.
Unfortunately this appeared to be in XML, and required a DTD which I could not find.
Perhaps if we:
A) Knew where the usb-hotplug-tutorial you found was located, or
B) Knew which DTD you needed but couldn't find, or
C) Knew which USB device you were interested in
then perhaps someone here could help you. Specific questions get specific answers.
Cheers
Tommy Reynolds wrote:
I was looking for a document that would explain how Linux/Fedora decides what driver to use with a given USB device, and google directed me to usb-hotplug-tutorial.
Unfortunately this appeared to be in XML, and required a DTD which I could not find.
Perhaps if we:
A) Knew where the usb-hotplug-tutorial you found was located, or
I think you will find there is only one document in the universe called usb-hotplug-tutorial. I found it at http://www2.frields.org:8080/WebSVN/listing.php?repname=fedora-docs&path=%2Fusb-hotplug-tutorial%2F&rev=0&sc=0 together with a Makefile. I said "make" and received a plethora of errors.
B) Knew which DTD you needed but couldn't find, or
Although some of the errors seemed to refer to DTDs, it appeared to me that the overall error was that I was not in the right context to process this document. My question was, what is the right context?
The question was not really about this specific document, but about the whole series of Fedora documents.
In my view, if something appears on the web with the word "document" in the title then it should be possible to read it, and if it is not immediately clear how to do this then there should be instructions given on how to process it.
C) Knew which USB device you were interested in
I am actually trying to get an Agere (Lucent) ORiNOCO USB Client (0x047e/0x0300) working. The device appears in /proc/bus/usb/devices but with no driver listed.
My question was, how does a USB device decide which driver to use, as eg a PCMCIA device looks in /etc/pcmcia/config . Is there a similar source for USB devices?
Specific questions get specific answers.
The question was a general one, as above - how does a USB device decide which driver to use? But if you are able to answer this in my specific case I would be very grateful.
On Tue, 2005-05-10 at 11:39 +0100, Timothy Murphy wrote:
My question was, how does a USB device decide which driver to use, as eg a PCMCIA device looks in /etc/pcmcia/config . Is there a similar source for USB devices?
FWIW, /lib/modules/$(uname -r)/modules.usbmap has what you're looking for. It's generated by depmod IIRC.
On Tue, 2005-05-10 at 11:39 +0100, Timothy Murphy wrote:
Tommy Reynolds wrote:
I think you will find there is only one document in the universe called usb-hotplug-tutorial. I found it at http://www2.frields.org:8080/WebSVN/listing.php?repname=fedora-docs&path=%2Fusb-hotplug-tutorial%2F&rev=0&sc=0 together with a Makefile. I said "make" and received a plethora of errors.
Although some of the errors seemed to refer to DTDs, it appeared to me that the overall error was that I was not in the right context to process this document. My question was, what is the right context?
Those files were originally written as part of a documentation module. If you look inside the Makefile, you'll see a need for a number of directories to be present at ../. The files are valid XML and will parse with the standard DocBook DTD. No special tools are required outside of what ships with Fedora Core.
Although not as easy to tell in the XML, this document was written for Fedora Core 2, documents an older method for handling USB hotplugging, and was never formally published. This is why you found it in an SVN sourcecode repository instead of converted to HTML and posted on http://fedora.redhat.com/docs.
The question was not really about this specific document, but about the whole series of Fedora documents.
In my view, if something appears on the web with the word "document" in the title then it should be possible to read it, and if it is not immediately clear how to do this then there should be instructions given on how to process it.
I do not see the word "document" in the title. Aside from that, your argument is specious. This is open source software we are using, the ultimate documentation is _always_ the source code. Your inability to understand it does not make it any less valid. Sorry if that is harsh, but it's a common truth.
Our standard document template could contain some directions on obtaining the sourcecode for the document. The directions currently on http://fedora.redhat.com/projects/docs will also work, as well as these from the Documentation Guide:
http://fedora.redhat.com/participate/documentation-guide/ch-getting-files.ht...
Other chapters explain thoroughly how to work with the XML.
BTW, the Documentation Guide is the first link for the Google search "how to build Fedora documentation."
FWIW, you most likely can run
docbook2html usb-hotplug-tutorial.xml
and receive a nicely formatted, black-and-white HTML file. xmlto also works nicely. A well considered Google search such as the following is helpful:
http://www.google.com/search?q=how+to+convert+docbook+to+html+in+Fedora
The question was a general one, as above - how does a USB device decide which driver to use? But if you are able to answer this in my specific case I would be very grateful.
End user questions are best asked on fedora-list, this list is for discussing Fedora documentation. Ol' Tommy threw us a red herring by trying to answer your technical question. :) Your comments about usability are appreciated.
- Karsten
Timothy Murphy wrote:
I was looking for a document that would explain how Linux/Fedora decides what driver to use with a given USB device, and google directed me to usb-hotplug-tutorial.
Unfortunately this appeared to be in XML, and required a DTD which I could not find.
Are these documents currently unreadable? If not, perhaps a link to an explanation of how to process them might be in order.
Via "google": http://docs.frields.org/ --> http://marilyn.frields.org:8080/fedora-docs/html/usb-hotplug-tutorial-en/
also for a very general description of the process navigate to: http://cyberelk.net/tim/usb-storage.html
Thomas
Thomas Jones wrote:
I was looking for a document that would explain how Linux/Fedora decides what driver to use with a given USB device, and google directed me to usb-hotplug-tutorial.
Unfortunately this appeared to be in XML, and required a DTD which I could not find.
http://marilyn.frields.org:8080/fedora-docs/html/usb-hotplug-tutorial-en/
Thank you, that is indeed the document I was looking for, in readable format.
also for a very general description of the process navigate to: http://cyberelk.net/tim/usb-storage.html
Unfortunately this seems very GNOME-specific, while I am using KDE, and the icons referred to in the document do not exist in my system. However, I shall look more carefully to see if I can cull some relevant information from it.
Incidentally, I wish people would stick to traditional "black on white" text. This document is almost unreadable on my laptop.
Perhaps this is the GUI equivalent of top-posting?
On Tue, 2005-05-10 at 11:53 +0100, Timothy Murphy wrote:
Thomas Jones wrote:
I was looking for a document that would explain how Linux/Fedora decides what driver to use with a given USB device, and google directed me to usb-hotplug-tutorial.
Unfortunately this appeared to be in XML, and required a DTD which I could not find.
I think we should consider requiring documentation to include a prominent link in the DTD comments that points people to a "how to build this document" spot on f.r.c. Anyone care to comment?
http://marilyn.frields.org:8080/fedora-docs/html/usb-hotplug-tutorial-en/
Thank you, that is indeed the document I was looking for, in readable format.
Woo-hoo, Google loveth me!
also for a very general description of the process navigate to: http://cyberelk.net/tim/usb-storage.html
Unfortunately this seems very GNOME-specific, while I am using KDE, and the icons referred to in the document do not exist in my system. However, I shall look more carefully to see if I can cull some relevant information from it.
Mine seems less GNOME-specific than Tim's document, but the steps will still work. Thank goodness it's open source! Even though you couldn't build the document from XML yourself, you can still suggest additional text to me concerning KDE. (I hope you already read the document's admonition that it concerns only Fedora Core 2 and previous versions, so you will find it less than helpful for Fedora Core 3 or higher.)
Incidentally, I wish people would stick to traditional "black on white" text. This document is almost unreadable on my laptop.
Hmm, it looks great on everything I've used, from CRT's to LCD's. What laptop are you using, perchance?
If you were building this document, you would find that the xmlto tool by Tim Waugh allows you to convert the original DocBook/XML text into straight ASCII text, which is about as "black on white" as you can get.
Perhaps this is the GUI equivalent of top-posting?
Nah, *no one* likes top-posting. But plenty of people like xmlto, because it lets you build the document into whatever you find most readable! :-)
On Tue, 2005-05-10 at 07:29 -0400, Paul W. Frields wrote:
On Tue, 2005-05-10 at 11:53 +0100, Timothy Murphy wrote:
Thomas Jones wrote:
I was looking for a document that would explain how Linux/Fedora decides what driver to use with a given USB device, and google directed me to usb-hotplug-tutorial.
Unfortunately this appeared to be in XML, and required a DTD which I could not find.
I think we should consider requiring documentation to include a prominent link in the DTD comments that points people to a "how to build this document" spot on f.r.c. Anyone care to comment?
We might want to make it a part of the template for the standard introduction/about this document section. Putting it in the XML would be a nice thing to do, too.
We can also put a link to the canonical location in the Documentation Guide. This would appear in the legalnotice-*.xml alongside the URL to the GFDL.
- Karsten
On Tue, 10 May 2005 04:57:31 -0700, "Karsten Wade" kwade@redhat.com said:
I think we should consider requiring documentation to include a prominent link in the DTD comments that points people to a "how to build this document" spot on f.r.c. Anyone care to comment?
We might want to make it a part of the template for the standard introduction/about this document section. Putting it in the XML would be a nice thing to do, too.
We can also put a link to the canonical location in the Documentation Guide. This would appear in the legalnotice-*.xml alongside the URL to the GFDL.
Perhaps just pop a README in CVS ?
I think that main issue is with raw source files, as HTML and PDF versions have already been built (by definition). --
Stuart Ellis
stuart@elsn.org
Fedora Documentation Project: http://fedora.redhat.com/projects/docs/
GPG key ID: 7098ABEA GPG key fingerprint: 68B0 E291 FB19 C845 E60E 9569 292E E365 7098 ABEA
Uttered "Paul W. Frields" stickster@gmail.com, spake thus:
I think we should consider requiring documentation to include a prominent link in the DTD comments that points people to a "how to build this document" spot on f.r.c. Anyone care to comment?
Well, none of the source code I come across on the web has a "how to compile me" comment in the "main.c" file ;-)
If folks come in by the backdoor via a Google search, and the don't bother to move up a level in the URL if there's something they don't understand then is a comment somewhere going to help them?
The reason my reply to the OP was border-line snide was to suggest that the question was not answerable in its current form and that the OP needed to do a bit more homework.
I think this is really a non-problem.
On Tue, 2005-05-10 at 11:06 -0500, Tommy Reynolds wrote:
Uttered "Paul W. Frields" stickster@gmail.com, spake thus:
I think we should consider requiring documentation to include a prominent link in the DTD comments that points people to a "how to
build
this document" spot on f.r.c. Anyone care to comment?
Well, none of the source code I come across on the web has a "how to compile me" comment in the "main.c" file ;-)
If folks come in by the backdoor via a Google search, and the don't bother to move up a level in the URL if there's something they don't understand then is a comment somewhere going to help them?
The reason my reply to the OP was border-line snide was to suggest that the question was not answerable in its current form and that the OP needed to do a bit more homework.
I think this is really a non-problem.
You may be right. My natural inclination -- and that of many others in the FDP -- is to try and make life easier for someone who is having difficulties, but there is a point beyond which the bar shouldn't be lowered. Otherwise we'd spend all our times fixing these kind of problems. Thanks for the reminder.
On Tue, 2005-05-10 at 11:53 +0100, Timothy Murphy wrote:
Thomas Jones wrote:
Unfortunately this seems very GNOME-specific, while I am using KDE, and the icons referred to in the document do not exist in my system. However, I shall look more carefully to see if I can cull some relevant information from it.
We currently don't have the resources to cover much more than the default Fedora Core. If you know of anyone who wants to produce KDE- specific versions of whatever documents we write, send them along.
Incidentally, I wish people would stick to traditional "black on white" text. This document is almost unreadable on my laptop.
Perhaps this is the GUI equivalent of top-posting?
No. Just a style choice, and not an uncommon one. The stylesheet is similar to the one that Red Hat has been using for some time. I see similar versions all over the Web. Feel free to offer a fix for the XSL. Perhaps we need to reconsider the accessibility of our stylesheet.
- Karsten
On Tue, May 10, 2005 at 04:56:17AM -0500, Thomas Jones wrote:
also for a very general description of the process navigate to: http://cyberelk.net/tim/usb-storage.html
I think that's out of date now. Hmm, I should put a note on that page saying so.
Tim. */