I've used fedup on 4 very different machines, and it has worked faultlessly.
My only gripe is the complete silence during hours of processing. Is there any reason why something - if even just a dot every minute or so - should not appear on the screen?
Of course an estimate of the expected duration would be even more helpful, or just a statement of how many packages have been processed, out of how many in total.
On 07/08/2013 07:03 AM, Timothy Murphy wrote:
I've used fedup on 4 very different machines, and it has worked faultlessly.
My only gripe is the complete silence during hours of processing. Is there any reason why something - if even just a dot every minute or so - should not appear on the screen?
Of course an estimate of the expected duration would be even more helpful, or just a statement of how many packages have been processed, out of how many in total.
Whoever writes the wiki article on fedup, should post a range of estimated-times-for-upgrade for each step of the process, with a set of total numbers of upgradeable packages.
He should also remind everybody: be sure to install all things fedup before you begin! That includes the fedup-plymouth package. When I installed fedup, Apper didn't resolve that particular dependency. So I checked it by hand to make sure I had it.
The Plymouth display needs to reach all the way across the screen. A progress bar no longer than three centimeters can make people think the upgrade has hung, when it hasn't. Happily, I had the disk-access pilot light to tell me that something was going on. Then the Plymouth progress bar went from just one dot to two or three, then to a millimeter. That's how I knew to wait.
The first step (#fedup-clii --network 19 or $sudo fedup-cli --network 19) at least echoes back a message with every package it downloads, and tells you how many are left. During the upgrade itself, you have to hit the Escape key to see that kind of display--and if you want to go back to the progress bar, it reads zero for the rest of the upgrade. (Maybe they'll fix that for 20.)
Now I ran a fedup session without error. But if the program had thrown an error, I'd have been out-of-luck. The community could use more information on how to recover from errors, and how not to throw them in the first place.
Temlakos
On Monday 08 July 2013 12:37:13 Tom Horsley wrote:
My only gripe is the complete silence during hours of processing.
Hours? Jeez. It doesn't take anything like "hours" for me to install from scratch and copy my old config by hand.
But does that include the download time for the DVD? Not everyone has the same download speeds. I have found that the net install on a new PC and a fedup install on an existing one to be about the same, minus the hastle of copying config's back. I'm just doing my first F19 fedup so fingers crossed
On 07/08/2013 07:57 AM, Gary Stainburn wrote:
On Monday 08 July 2013 12:37:13 Tom Horsley wrote:
My only gripe is the complete silence during hours of processing.
Hours? Jeez. It doesn't take anything like "hours" for me to install from scratch and copy my old config by hand.
But does that include the download time for the DVD? Not everyone has the same download speeds. I have found that the net install on a new PC and a fedup install on an existing one to be about the same, minus the hastle of copying config's back. I'm just doing my first F19 fedup so fingers crossed
It should work. It worked for me. And you have a good point: to compare installation and upgrade times, compare all the time you take, including downloading the installation media. And add this, too: having to run a long update session after installing from already-obsolete media. Not so bad after a week of release, but that problem will only get worse with every passing week.
Better to install with a network connection, if you can keep it.
Temlakos
On Mon, 8 Jul 2013 12:57:00 +0100 Gary Stainburn wrote:
But does that include the download time for the DVD?
Nope, but my system stays up and is usable in a normal state while I'm downloading the DVD prior to an install from scratch :-).
In fact with my latest preferred install technique my system stays up while I'm installing as well since I install to a virtual machine, then copy the VM disk image to the partition I want to run on. (Solves all the problems of not being able to tell what on earth anaconda is gonna do to my disks :-).
Timothy Murphy writes:
I've used fedup on 4 very different machines, and it has worked faultlessly.
My only gripe is the complete silence during hours of processing. Is there any reason why something - if even just a dot every minute or so - should not appear on the screen?
There is a progress bar, that creeps slowly, through the update process.
Allegedly, on or about 08 July 2013, Timothy Murphy sent:
Of course an estimate of the expected duration would be even more helpful, or just a statement of how many packages have been processed, out of how many in total.
It's often been said that it's hard to estimate how long to completion (though previous installers have done so, with reasonable accuracy), but I can see no argument against writing 12 out of 200 packages have been installed. Or showing a list of steps, that gradually get ticked off (downloading, partitioning, formatting, installing...). Or simply a scrolling log of what it's actually doing at the moment, on part of the screen, with something else permanently visible to give you a fighting chance of knowing how far along the routine it's gone.
On Monday 08 July 2013 13:06:12 Tom Horsley wrote:
On Mon, 8 Jul 2013 12:57:00 +0100
Gary Stainburn wrote:
But does that include the download time for the DVD?
Nope, but my system stays up and is usable in a normal state while I'm downloading the DVD prior to an install from scratch :-).
In fact with my latest preferred install technique my system stays up while I'm installing as well since I install to a virtual machine, then copy the VM disk image to the partition I want to run on. (Solves all the problems of not being able to tell what on earth anaconda is gonna do to my disks :-).
I have tried that before but so that I have a workable image that I can then just write to as many HDD's as required to build additional servers, or simulate an upgrade of a production server but struggled to get the resulting system to boot.
For information, the fedup upgrade worked perfectly for me for the box I've just done and took little over the lunch time I left it to do it's job.
On Monday 08 July 2013 16:17:39 Gary Stainburn wrote:
I have tried that before but so that I have a workable image that I can then just write to as many HDD's as required to build additional servers, or simulate an upgrade of a production server but struggled to get the resulting system to boot.
For information, the fedup upgrade worked perfectly for me for the box I've just done and took little over the lunch time I left it to do it's job.
I did my laptop F18 -> F19 this morning. It took 1 hour 40 which was longer than my desktop but still okay as I just left it to it, and the only input required was the reboot.
The best news is that as I had hoped, the upgrade mended the touchpad which broke when I did the fedup from F17 -> 18 so I'm a happy chappy
Gary Stainburn wrote:
I did my laptop F18 -> F19 this morning. It took 1 hour 40 which was longer than my desktop but still okay as I just left it to it, and the only input required was the reboot.
Is this the whole kaboosh, or the bit after re-booting? It's the bit after re-booting (several hours in my case) where I'd like to be given an estimate of expected duration. I know there is that little growing snake under the F, but that's a bit like watching paint dry.
Great product though, who should we thank?
On Tuesday 09 July 2013 13:27:09 Timothy Murphy wrote:
Gary Stainburn wrote:
I did my laptop F18 -> F19 this morning. It took 1 hour 40 which was longer than my desktop but still okay as I just left it to it, and the only input required was the reboot.
Is this the whole kaboosh, or the bit after re-booting? It's the bit after re-booting (several hours in my case) where I'd like to be given an estimate of expected duration. I know there is that little growing snake under the F, but that's a bit like watching paint dry.
Great product though, who should we thank?
This was the whole thing, from issuing the
'fedup --network 19'
to having a fully functioning laptop (including touchpad :D )
On both of the installs I've done so far I did get a graphic loco and a progress bar. I'm guessing that if you don't get that it may have been a video card issue.
On the one I did yesterday I ended up with a text based detail view, which I think I got by catching the TAB key with my phone.
Wow! well this is great news for me, as I was holding off upgrading for fear of something going wrong. And bear in mind I have a full backup of my system, it's just that I have scarce time to babysit a full restore...but I guess I'll give it an attempt this coming weekend over a cup of Earl Grey!
EGO II
On 07/09/2013 04:11 AM, Gary Stainburn wrote:
On Monday 08 July 2013 16:17:39 Gary Stainburn wrote:
I have tried that before but so that I have a workable image that I can then just write to as many HDD's as required to build additional servers, or simulate an upgrade of a production server but struggled to get the resulting system to boot.
For information, the fedup upgrade worked perfectly for me for the box I've just done and took little over the lunch time I left it to do it's job.
I did my laptop F18 -> F19 this morning. It took 1 hour 40 which was longer than my desktop but still okay as I just left it to it, and the only input required was the reboot.
The best news is that as I had hoped, the upgrade mended the touchpad which broke when I did the fedup from F17 -> 18 so I'm a happy chappy
On 07/09/2013 08:27 AM, Timothy Murphy wrote:
Gary Stainburn wrote:
I did my laptop F18 -> F19 this morning. It took 1 hour 40 which was longer than my desktop but still okay as I just left it to it, and the only input required was the reboot.
Is this the whole kaboosh, or the bit after re-booting? It's the bit after re-booting (several hours in my case) where I'd like to be given an estimate of expected duration. I know there is that little growing snake under the F, but that's a bit like watching paint dry.
Great product though, who should we thank?
Thank the developers of fedup, of course. For enduring our endless "hazing" with the F17-F18 upgrade, and proving they could work the kinks out of it.
I go back to the suggestion I would like to emphasize most: lengthen the progress bar (the growing snake) from the current 3 cm to 10 cm at least, or even 15 cm. The improved "resolution" would allow you to show /some/ forward progress more often.
Temlakos
I've used fedup on 4 very different machines, and it has worked faultlessly.
Thanks for reporting. I was afraid of upgrading (F18->F19) and would have waited months. After your message, I did it and it worked perfectly well: 1. I downloaded the DVD iso: Fedora-19-x86_64-DVD.iso 2. fedup --iso Fedora-19-x86_64-DVD.iso --network 19 --reboot It took 42 minutes before automatically rebooting. The total upgrade duration was 2 hours. This leaves 1h18 for installation. I launched that before going to bed. In the morning, everything worked perfectly apart that the default session type was changed from KDE to gnome.
Thanks to the fedora team,
Frédéric
On 07/09/2013 02:17 PM, Frédéric Bron wrote:
I've used fedup on 4 very different machines, and it has worked faultlessly.
Thanks for reporting. I was afraid of upgrading (F18->F19) and would have waited months. After your message, I did it and it worked perfectly well:
- I downloaded the DVD iso: Fedora-19-x86_64-DVD.iso
- fedup --iso Fedora-19-x86_64-DVD.iso --network 19 --reboot
It took 42 minutes before automatically rebooting. The total upgrade duration was 2 hours. This leaves 1h18 for installation. I launched that before going to bed. In the morning, everything worked perfectly apart that the default session type was changed from KDE to gnome.
Thanks to the fedora team,
Frédéric
So then out of curiosity mind you......there's no way to get a different session and have it automatically be there when its done?...like XFCE?...or MATE?...
EGO II
On 07/09/2013 11:19 AM, Eddie G. O'Connor Jr. wrote:
So then out of curiosity mind you......there's no way to get a different session and have it automatically be there when its done?...like XFCE?...or MATE?...
What I want to know is, what does fedup do if, as in my case, Gnome isn't installed?
I had one good and two not so good experiences.
At home going from 18 to 19 went real smooth, no issues. At work one 17 to 19 and one 18 to 19 both had issues that I eventually muddled my way through. Both of those were likely due to my use of a locally hosted mirror of the various repos. So /etc/yum.conf didn't get updated and left a bunch of packages to be updated with a few dependency issues to resolve. But after a whole lot of work with yum and rpm I have both of those systems working fine and using our local repos once again.
On 07/09/2013 11:45 AM, Frédéric Bron wrote:
So then out of curiosity mind you......there's no way to get a different session and have it automatically be there when its done?...like XFCE?...or MATE?...
no, it's just the first time. Then it remembers your choice. Frédéric
But if it's an upgrade, shouldn't it remember your choice from before the upgrade?
On 07/09/2013 03:04 PM, Joe Zeff wrote:
On 07/09/2013 11:45 AM, Frédéric Bron wrote:
So then out of curiosity mind you......there's no way to get a different session and have it automatically be there when its done?...like XFCE?...or MATE?...
no, it's just the first time. Then it remembers your choice. Frédéric
But if it's an upgrade, shouldn't it remember your choice from before the upgrade?
It does, actually. It upgrades whatever packages you have installed. That is, /if/ you use a straight network upgrade. I think the mistake someone made was to upgrade from .iso as well as network.
Temlakos
On 07/09/2013 12:08 PM, Temlakos wrote:
It does, actually. It upgrades whatever packages you have installed. That is, /if/ you use a straight network upgrade. I think the mistake someone made was to upgrade from .iso as well as network.
Oh, good. I remember that the last time I used the old preupgrade, it defaulted back to Gnome 3, even though I had Xfce selected before. Of course, that was before something went mung and I had to reinstall, leaving Gnome out completely. I think it was the only time I ever actually used Gnome 3, and that was only long enough to figure out how to log out and correct it.
On 07/09/2013 03:21 PM, Joe Zeff wrote:
On 07/09/2013 12:08 PM, Temlakos wrote:
It does, actually. It upgrades whatever packages you have installed. That is, /if/ you use a straight network upgrade. I think the mistake someone made was to upgrade from .iso as well as network.
Oh, good. I remember that the last time I used the old preupgrade, it defaulted back to Gnome 3, even though I had Xfce selected before. Of course, that was before something went mung and I had to reinstall, leaving Gnome out completely. I think it was the only time I ever actually used Gnome 3, and that was only long enough to figure out how to log out and correct it.
Maybe you still haven't used fedup yet. The fedup-cli command needs to know one thing, if you tell it nothing else: where to find the new versions of the software. I used network.
And then it examined every package I had, and simply looked on the network for the version from F19. And that included looking into every repository I was set up to use with yum.
When it was done, it said to reboot.
That's the part that took me a long time--two and one-half hours. But at the end of it, I was still using KDE, and had my existing background and other setups.
Temlakos
On 07/09/2013 12:25 PM, Temlakos wrote:
Maybe you still haven't used fedup yet.
No. There were so many horror stories about going from F17 to 18, either by fedup or fresh install that I've kept to 17. Now, I'm seeing very few threads about failed upgrades to 19 so I'm going to upgrade my laptop RSN, and once that's stable, my desktop. That way, if there's a problem with one the other's usable.
On 07/09/2013 02:45 PM, Frédéric Bron wrote:
So then out of curiosity mind you......there's no way to get a different session and have it automatically be there when its done?...like XFCE?...or MATE?...
no, it's just the first time. Then it remembers your choice. Frédéric
Oh!....ok...cool! I'll be going forward with the upgrade later on this week....or possibly this weekend! Can't wait!
EGO II
On 07/09/2013 02:46 PM, Frédéric Bron wrote:
What I want to know is, what does fedup do if, as in my case, Gnome isn't installed?
Don't know that. Sorry. Frédéric
Doesn't it kind of "put" it there?...as a default?...or will it configure some sort of interface so that you can install it? Otherwise it'll be the Command Line for you! LoL!
EGO II
On 07/09/2013 03:04 PM, Joe Zeff wrote:
On 07/09/2013 11:45 AM, Frédéric Bron wrote:
So then out of curiosity mind you......there's no way to get a different session and have it automatically be there when its done?...like XFCE?...or MATE?...
no, it's just the first time. Then it remembers your choice. Frédéric
But if it's an upgrade, shouldn't it remember your choice from before the upgrade?
Good point!
EGO II
On 07/09/2013 03:08 PM, Temlakos wrote:
On 07/09/2013 03:04 PM, Joe Zeff wrote:
On 07/09/2013 11:45 AM, Frédéric Bron wrote:
So then out of curiosity mind you......there's no way to get a different session and have it automatically be there when its done?...like XFCE?...or MATE?...
no, it's just the first time. Then it remembers your choice. Frédéric
But if it's an upgrade, shouldn't it remember your choice from before the upgrade?
It does, actually. It upgrades whatever packages you have installed. That is, /if/ you use a straight network upgrade. I think the mistake someone made was to upgrade from .iso as well as network.
Temlakos
Hmm....but even the .iso comes with "Gnome" as the default interface no?I remember when I had to download the F18 .iso, I was given "choices" a to what desktop interface I wanted to see Gnome...KDE....XFCE....LXDE...etc.
EGO II
On 07/09/2013 05:04 PM, Eddie G. O'Connor Jr. wrote:
On 07/09/2013 03:08 PM, Temlakos wrote:
On 07/09/2013 03:04 PM, Joe Zeff wrote:
On 07/09/2013 11:45 AM, Frédéric Bron wrote:
So then out of curiosity mind you......there's no way to get a different session and have it automatically be there when its done?...like XFCE?...or MATE?...
no, it's just the first time. Then it remembers your choice. Frédéric
But if it's an upgrade, shouldn't it remember your choice from before the upgrade?
It does, actually. It upgrades whatever packages you have installed. That is, /if/ you use a straight network upgrade. I think the mistake someone made was to upgrade from .iso as well as network.
Temlakos
Hmm....but even the .iso comes with "Gnome" as the default interface no?I remember when I had to download the F18 .iso, I was given "choices" a to what desktop interface I wanted to see Gnome...KDE....XFCE....LXDE...etc.
EGO II
The original poster had chosen a different desktop--but maybe because he used the --iso option, fedup took upon itself to change his desktop to Gnome.
I used --network only. I started with KDE and finished with KDE.
Temlakos
On 07/09/2013 05:06 PM, Temlakos wrote:
On 07/09/2013 05:04 PM, Eddie G. O'Connor Jr. wrote:
On 07/09/2013 03:08 PM, Temlakos wrote:
On 07/09/2013 03:04 PM, Joe Zeff wrote:
On 07/09/2013 11:45 AM, Frédéric Bron wrote:
So then out of curiosity mind you......there's no way to get a different session and have it automatically be there when its done?...like XFCE?...or MATE?...
no, it's just the first time. Then it remembers your choice. Frédéric
But if it's an upgrade, shouldn't it remember your choice from before the upgrade?
It does, actually. It upgrades whatever packages you have installed. That is, /if/ you use a straight network upgrade. I think the mistake someone made was to upgrade from .iso as well as network.
Temlakos
Hmm....but even the .iso comes with "Gnome" as the default interface no?I remember when I had to download the F18 .iso, I was given "choices" a to what desktop interface I wanted to see Gnome...KDE....XFCE....LXDE...etc.
EGO II
The original poster had chosen a different desktop--but maybe because he used the --iso option, fedup took upon itself to change his desktop to Gnome.
I used --network only. I started with KDE and finished with KDE.
Temlakos
Oh! ok.....that explains it! So then theoretically I should be able to use the fedup-cli command and upgrade my system, without having anything change except the versions of the applications installed on my system....right? And the things that are "deprecated" (no longer suppoerted?) will be replaced with things that ARE?...(and I know these might sound like "stoopid"questions, but when I went from F17 to F18 I had nothing to lose...the system was brand new...and I had been running 17 for about a month or two but now?...I have amassed a LOT of stuff!)
EGO II
EGO II
On 07/09/2013 02:02 PM, Eddie G. O'Connor Jr. wrote:
On 07/09/2013 02:46 PM, Frédéric Bron wrote:
What I want to know is, what does fedup do if, as in my case, Gnome isn't installed?
Don't know that. Sorry. Frédéric
Doesn't it kind of "put" it there?...as a default?...or will it configure some sort of interface so that you can install it? Otherwise it'll be the Command Line for you! LoL!
My laptop only has Xfce installed and uses lightdm, not gdm, but it still lists a GNOME session as well as the one I actually use. I've no idea what would happen if I selected it, and I'm not really interested in trying.
On Tue, Jul 09, 2013 at 05:16:58PM -0400, Eddie G. O'Connor Jr. wrote:
Oh! ok.....that explains it! So then theoretically I should be able to use the fedup-cli command and upgrade my system, without having anything change except the versions of the applications installed on my system....right? And the things that are "deprecated" (no longer suppoerted?) will be replaced with things that ARE?...(and I know these might sound like "stoopid"questions, but when I went from F17 to F18 I had nothing to lose...the system was brand new...and I had been running 17 for about a month or two but now?...I have amassed a LOT of stuff!)
EGO II
EGO II
Theoretically yes, but as always with any major system operations, *back up* any important data.
On 07/09/2013 05:27 PM, staticsafe wrote:
On Tue, Jul 09, 2013 at 05:16:58PM -0400, Eddie G. O'Connor Jr. wrote:
Oh! ok.....that explains it! So then theoretically I should be able to use the fedup-cli command and upgrade my system, without having anything change except the versions of the applications installed on my system....right? And the things that are "deprecated" (no longer suppoerted?) will be replaced with things that ARE?...(and I know these might sound like "stoopid"questions, but when I went from F17 to F18 I had nothing to lose...the system was brand new...and I had been running 17 for about a month or two but now?...I have amassed a LOT of stuff!)
EGO II
EGO II
Theoretically yes, but as always with any major system operations, *back up* any important data.
But of COURSE! LoL!
EGO II