Hi,
I'm still trying to sort out the sound problem I'm currently experiencing on my box and I'm looking at hwbrowser.
Now, the soundcards are showing up happily there as is the floppy drive (as /dev/fd0 - this is missing in /udev). There is an equivalent entry in /udev for all of my hard and optical drives (/dev/hdx etc), there isn't a /udev entry for /dev/eth0 though
Is /udev supposed to be a direct mirror of /dev and is it now the case that /udev is accessed in preference to /dev (which would account for the lack of sound here - /udev/audio, /udev/dsp and /udev/mixer are all reported as being missing)?
TTFN
Paul
Paul,
Compare the output of the following
lsof | grep udev lsof | fgrep /dev
also what version of udev and initscripts are you running?
I know from my own personal experience running the utopia stack through its growth phase from February thru the summer, there were some issues with the "udev as dev" cut over. I'm not even sure I should have the dev package installed anymore, but anyway it is my understanding that nothing should be touching anything in /udev. Only the nodes in /dev should be used. It took me an entire eventing to 1 figure that out and 2) get all my sound things pointing back to /dev.
Do you have selinux enforcing? Also wasn't there some broken-ness around the ramfs to tempfs change over for /dev and mkinitrd? That is only in the very recent updates.
HTH,
Andrew
On my system nothing is using nodes in /udev -- # rpm -q udev udev-030-10 # rpm -q initscripts initscripts-7.73-1 (yeah I know thats 3 weeks old but.. still) they work.
# lsof | fgrep /udev udevd 372 root txt REG 3,2 10324 8962153 /sbin/udevd
[Just the one item]
lsof | fgrep /dev | more init 1 root 10u FIFO 3,2 3218125 /dev/initctl netplugd 3112 root 0u CHR 1,3 3217216 /dev/null ... syslogd 3153 root 0u unix 0x1cac9980 5213 /dev/log slapd 3233 ldap 0u CHR 1,3 3217216 /dev/null slapd 3233 ldap 1u CHR 1,3 3217216 /dev/null ... smbd 3716 root 3r CHR 1,9 3222909 /dev/urandom .. mingetty 3823 root 0u CHR 4,1 3222006 /dev/tty1 mingetty 3823 root 1u CHR 4,1 3222006 /dev/tty1 ... mixer_app 13965 andrew 35u CHR 14,0 3213762 /dev/mixer mixer_app 13965 andrew 36u CHR 116,0 3244050 /dev/snd/controlC0 ... [the output above was trimmed down since it was several pages... you get the idea]
Paul wrote:
Hi,
I'm still trying to sort out the sound problem I'm currently experiencing on my box and I'm looking at hwbrowser.
Now, the soundcards are showing up happily there as is the floppy drive (as /dev/fd0 - this is missing in /udev). There is an equivalent entry in /udev for all of my hard and optical drives (/dev/hdx etc), there isn't a /udev entry for /dev/eth0 though
Is /udev supposed to be a direct mirror of /dev and is it now the case that /udev is accessed in preference to /dev (which would account for the lack of sound here - /udev/audio, /udev/dsp and /udev/mixer are all reported as being missing)?
TTFN
Paul
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
On Sunday 12 September 2004 18:17, Andrew wrote:
nothing should be touching anything in /udev. Only the nodes in /dev should be used. It took me an entire eventing to 1 figure that out and 2) get all my sound things pointing back to /dev.
I wish RH would maintain a little "new technologies" page on their site, this HAL, udev, mdnsresponder etc have been showing up in FC3 and I don't have any idea what they are. The Jargon Buster on the Fedora page doesn't know what they are either. If it already exists somewhere please reply pointing to it :-)
Anyway, my little store of knowledge on the subject of /dev (not udev) says that you can make device "files" anywhere, not just in /dev, and that you can have multiple device files for the same device no problem. The major and minor numbers you give mknod make the file "special" and associated with a particular kernel device driver on the kernel side, not that it is in /dev. Whether this is useful to unpicking the mysteries I am not sure.
- -Andy
- -- http://www.addintelligence.co.uk -- we design custom hardware and software for your products
Hi,
Andy Green wrote:
I wish RH would maintain a little "new technologies" page on their site, this HAL, udev, mdnsresponder etc have been showing up in FC3 and I don't have any idea what they are. The Jargon Buster on the Fedora page doesn't know what they are either. If it already exists somewhere please reply pointing to it :-)
Actually David Zeuthen has a lot of good stuff over at freedesktop.org especially on hal as he is the primary author. http://freedesktop.org/Software/hal http://news.gmane.org/gmane.comp.freedesktop.hal [ for the hal list ] This is where the hal developers do there thing, a lot of the dev process patches and so on, but reading helped me a lot. http://mail.gnome.org/archives/utopia-list [ for the utopia list ]
for udev look at http://webpages.charter.net/decibelshelp/LinuxHelp_UDEVPrimer.html
Hal is great! it is one of the most important things I have seen to date (at least since RH 6) in making Linux a really usable desktop. With utopia (hal dbus and gnome-volume-manager) I can (as a non-admin) plug in my usb flash drive and it will detect, create a mount point if needed and mount it and pop window with the contents automatically -- just like other desktop OSes that are very much less than free! Plus, you can create policy rules to keep that from happening if you want to, but at least now it can work without having to either su or sudo!
Anyway, my little store of knowledge on the subject of /dev (not udev) says that you can make device "files" anywhere, not just in /dev, and that you can have multiple device files for the same device no problem. The major and minor numbers you give mknod make the file "special" and associated with a particular kernel device driver on the kernel side, not that it is in /dev. Whether this is useful to unpicking the mysteries I am not sure.
Of course that's true, its just getting the the right stuff in the place the rest of the sound code is looking for them. (or making it look in the right places)
Andrew
- -Andy
http://www.addintelligence.co.uk -- we design custom hardware and software for your products -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.6 (GNU/Linux)
iD8DBQFBRIc7jKeDCxMJCTIRAoZCAKCN0A5F83/7FbmDXER/hr6+2aBmGQCfUwIZ oKPXyD7+QBFKe6A8foJXwv4= =b4eT -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
On Sunday 12 September 2004 19:13, Andrew wrote:
http://freedesktop.org/Software/hal http://news.gmane.org/gmane.comp.freedesktop.hal [ for the hal list ] http://mail.gnome.org/archives/utopia-list [ for the utopia list ] http://webpages.charter.net/decibelshelp/LinuxHelp_UDEVPrimer.html
Thanks for the links Andrew :-)
mdnsresponder seems to be some apple-inspired zero configuration network plug and play thing:
http://developer.apple.com/macosx/rendezvous/index.html
Rendezvous enables automatic discovery of computers, devices, and services on IP networks. Also known as zero-configuration networking, Rendezvous uses industry standard IP protocols to allow devices to automatically find each other without the need to enter IP addresses or configure DNS servers. Rendezvous is an open protocol, which Apple has submitted to the IETF as part of the ongoing standards-creation process. In order to provide a true zero-configuration experience, Rendezvous requires that devices implement three essential things. These devices must be able to
* allocate IP addresses without a DHCP server * translate between names and IP addresses without a DNS server * locate or advertise services without using a directory server
- -Andy
- -- http://www.addintelligence.co.uk -- we design custom hardware and software for your products
On Sun, Sep 12, 2004 at 07:36:55PM +0100, Andy Green wrote:
http://developer.apple.com/macosx/rendezvous/index.html
Rendezvous enables automatic discovery of computers, devices, and services on
Its properly "Zeroconf". Apple got sued by Tibco over the name as Rendezvous was a Tibco trademark. The out of court settlement means Apple will be updating the name. Also Rendezvous is an applename while Zeroconf is an IETF name so more general.
Alan
Hi,
lsof | grep udev
About 12 lines long
lsof | fgrep /dev
Bloomin' massive, though there is only 3 or 4 lines concerning udev
also what version of udev and initscripts are you running?
udev-030-24 initscripts-7.80-1 dev-3.12-1
I know from my own personal experience running the utopia stack through its growth phase from February thru the summer, there were some issues with the "udev as dev" cut over. I'm not even sure I should have the dev package installed anymore, but anyway it is my understanding that nothing should be touching anything in /udev. Only the nodes in /dev should be used. It took me an entire eventing to 1 figure that out and 2) get all my sound things pointing back to /dev.
How did you manage to do that?
Do you have selinux enforcing?
Not sure. I'm don't have anything specified on boot up, so I'll guess at strict. However, I don't think that's really the main problem as if I run without selinux on at all, I get the same result of no sound.
Also wasn't there some broken-ness around the ramfs to tempfs change over for /dev and mkinitrd? That is only in the very recent updates.
Which is probably what has hit me as sound was working prior to the update run on Friday night.
TTFN
Paul
Paul wrote:
lsof | grep udev
About 12 lines long
If none of the lines are not sound related then perhaps its not really a /udev vs /dev problem with the sound. What do you have in /proc/asound ... and what about an the output of aplay -l and aplay -L watch out for the aplay -L it outputs to stderr not stdout so I usually do a aplay -L 2>junk && less junk
If that is all nicely populated and you get output from aplay -l, then I would ask if you are using ALSA output [libALSA.so] in xmms and device hw:0,0
I know from my own personal experience running the utopia stack through its growth phase from February thru the summer, there were some issues with the "udev as dev" cut over. I'm not even sure I should have the dev package installed anymore, but anyway it is my understanding that nothing should be touching anything in /udev. Only the nodes in /dev should be used. It took me an entire eventing to 1 figure that out and 2) get all my sound things pointing back to /dev.
How did you manage to do that?
Arrgh, actually that was quite a while ago, and I was merging that in my memory -- I guess I need an upgrade --was my "fun" last week when I was getting my Softlink modem with the intel8x0m ALSA driver working -- it kept loading the modem first, so all my sound was then going to the modem and not the real sound hardware. However, I think I put a device item in my /etc/esd.conf to at least get my gnome sounds to work -- if you are a KDE guy there must be an arts equiv. If you are using gnome, maybe a esdmon /udev/dsp[ 0] or esdmon /dev/dsp[ 0] might work. If they don't exist you might try mknod using the major and minors from the /dev or /udev for the missing devices and see if it then just works. The why, of course, will be easier to find after that.
Which is probably what has hit me as sound was working prior to the update run on Friday night.
Ahh, the wonder and happiness of RAWHIDE!
HTH,
Andrew ------------------- Mine looks like this
ls -la /proc/asound total 1 dr-xr-xr-x 5 root root 0 Sep 12 17:16 . dr-xr-xr-x 139 root root 0 Sep 2 18:16 .. dr-xr-xr-x 7 root root 0 Sep 12 17:16 card0 -r--r--r-- 1 root root 0 Sep 12 17:16 cards -r--r--r-- 1 root root 0 Sep 12 17:16 devices -r--r--r-- 1 root root 0 Sep 12 17:16 modules lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 5 Sep 12 17:16 nForce2 -> card0 dr-xr-xr-x 2 root root 0 Sep 12 17:16 oss -r--r--r-- 1 root root 0 Sep 12 17:16 pcm dr-xr-xr-x 2 root root 0 Sep 12 17:16 seq -r--r--r-- 1 root root 0 Sep 12 17:16 timers -r--r--r-- 1 root root 0 Sep 12 17:16 version
cat /proc/asound/devices 0: [0- 0]: ctl 18: [0- 2]: digital audio playback 25: [0- 1]: digital audio capture 16: [0- 0]: digital audio playback 24: [0- 0]: digital audio capture 33: : timer
cat /proc/asound/modules 0 snd_intel8x0
cat /proc/asound/cards 0 [nForce2 ]: NFORCE - NVidia nForce2 NVidia nForce2 at 0xed001000, irq 5
aplay -l **** List of PLAYBACK Hardware Devices **** card 0: nForce2 [NVidia nForce2], device 0: Intel ICH [NVidia nForce2] Subdevices: 1/1 Subdevice #0: subdevice #0 card 0: nForce2 [NVidia nForce2], device 2: Intel ICH - IEC958 [NVidia nForce2 - IEC958] Subdevices: 1/1 Subdevice #0: subdevice #0
On Mon, 2004-13-09 at 17:17 +0200, Harald Hoyer wrote:
never saw such a device node on my system... be it normal /dev or udev. on which OS did you see that? :)
Speaking of /udev I have the package intsalled, but I only have a /dev and no /udev
Do I need to do something here?
Everything seems to be working :)
Rob.
On Mon, Sep 13, 2004 at 12:37:58PM -0400, Robert Couture wrote:
Speaking of /udev I have the package intsalled, but I only have a /dev and no /udev
There is no /udev. The conversation is about 'dev' and 'udev' packages. If you installed the later, and you _started it_, then you are using 'udev'; otherwise this is 'dev'.
In practical terms, and for Fedora test installations, if '/proc/mounts' shows that something is mounted on /dev, and you see there only "some" devices instead of "the whole pile of these just in case", then you are using 'udev' as opposed to a "regular" '/dev/' tree you had for years.
There is quite a bit of documentation in /usr/share/doc/udev-* which explains a number of things.
Michal