On Sun, Sep 9, 2018 at 10:48 PM, Brian (bex) Exelbierd <bexelbie@redhat.com> wrote:


On Wed, Aug 29, 2018 at 4:23 AM, Rafal Luzynski <digitalfreak@lingonborough.com> wrote:
28.08.2018 04:16 Noriko Mizumoto <noriko.mizumoto@gmail.com> wrote:
> [...]
> As long as You and Me are happy to keep contributing the translation, I
> think that is fine and that is the opensource, isn't? Unless a
> maintainer refuses to add in his package.

Well, actually I don't contribute to the translation because Piotr does
his work so completely and perfectly that there is usually nothing more
to add. What I sometimes do includes providing and fixing metadata for
other languages. Sometimes this may mean languages which do not have
their translation teams or the teams are just being created.

> [...]
> Four years back, when we have moved to Zanata.
> Upon request from Zanata team, I coordinated to create final language
> list to add in Zanata. Only language teams who responded have been
> added, and in result, a number of language teams I cut off due to no
> response. Obvious, no respond no one to work, no point to add.
> Repeating this process may help?

No, the context (offline) of this discussion is not about removing the
languages but about adding them. Should we add a language because somebody
(a native speaker) asks us and then disappears and never comes back? Should
we add a language because we (or someone else) look at the map of the world
and discover an uncovered area?

Could we achieve a system where we add languages on request, but only ask maintainers to include them when they reach a certain percentage complete?  This would also be a floor to cause a language to be considered for removal from active publishing.  This way we never turn away anyone and we don't have to debate whether it is used or not.  This would also give us a basis for having a conversation with maintainers and have something we can publish to "shout" about translations and know the result could be valuable to people.



( just an idea - would need inputs on this - not sure how much this would help here )  

In Transtats ( at transtats.xyz ) we have relationship whereby people can traverse from  Fedora Release > Language > Packages. There we have some information on "how languages are doing at translation platform?" but this depends on list of packages added. 
Secondly, as it has statistics from build system, hence, some interface could be created for "how languages > packages are doing at build system?" - so, this at-a-glace picture could help both 1) Language Maintainers and 2) Package Maintainers. 

And, slowly over a few fedora releases we can have history of "how languages performed in last few fedora releases?" - which could influence this decision of - whether to keep X language in active publishing. I know here - we are trying to decide on "norms" which we should have to decide on "Languages List?". I have one more point - "How to decide on Packages List?"

Not sure, mostly for - Languages List, may be l10n team (language coordinators) can help us and for Packages List may be - i18n and i18n-qe team can help!

Technically, people see first languages list at anaconda, which is primarily from https://raw.githubusercontent.com/mike-fabian/langtable/master/data/languages.xml
Languages list at every translation platform may differ. For DamnedLies its 185: https://l10n.gnome.org/languages/ ,   for fedora.zanata its 101: https://fedora.zanata.org/languages , for weblate (demo) its 50+: https://demo.weblate.org/languages/    In fedora we have people using many different platforms to translate (obviously for us its Zanata - as our platform) -- but good news is: everything is built in koji !!

So, if we decide on "Language List" and "Package List" - interfaces could be created (based on stats from koji) in Transtats to see - "How much of fedora is ready in X languages?"

thanks,
sundeep

 
regards,

bex
 

> [...]
> Fedora, afaik, will be used by downstreams. Some contributors may work
> for this purpose. Are those distributions' users to be included in the
> count as well?

I think you mean forks of Fedora. Not even spins but forks. So, no, I think
we don't count anything about forks even now. If somebody takes the source
code of Fedora, modifies it, builds another distro and publishes it
(I assume this is all legal) then we have no control and even no knowledge
about it. The same about other distros which are not related with Fedora.

Thank you for your feedback, Noriko. Best regards,

Rafal
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--
Brian (bex) Exelbierd | bexelbie@redhat.com | bex@pobox.com
Fedora Community Action & Impact Coordinator
@bexelbie | http://www.winglemeyer.org

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