Top Posting:
I think, everyone has cleared points they want to say, so lets stop here. Our ultimate desire is to make Fedora better.

Besnik first of appreciated and thank you for your long time contribution to Fedora project and leading Albanian language group.

And also whole Albanian group for excelling in last two Fedora translation sprint. [1]  Fedora 25 there was bit drop but that happens in community driven project. Specifically thanks to Jona as well for help in organizing both sprints.

Here looks classic problem of miscommunication, so lets think what can we do for it.
* Start all communications regarding review etc on sq mailing list.
* Besnik - You are well experienced in Sq translation. In my humble opinion, its time to motivate new contributors and train them to take responsibility. Now as a coordinator you should think, how you want to go ahead with this. As a new contributors everyone is bound to make mistake and here you suppose to guide/mentor them. But unless until we do not give chance i don't think so, one will get chance to make mistake.
  -  I think at least lets start with giving someone deserving as per you and team "Reviewer" role in Zanata.
* I am not expert but there is Style Guide [2] for most of the language, it will be nice, if we can have one for SQ as well. It will solve many major issues in future.
* Mailing list admin is really minor issue, we have an excellent Fedora Infra team very active in all Admin related issue. If someone think, there is an issue feel free to ping them.

Lets at least start with above suggested steps. Feel free to comment if there is any issue in doing it.

Again let me say, we all are volunteer contributors and it in itself make everyone great. This debate shows how much do we care for Fedora. :)

Best Regards,
Pravin Satpute

On 17 October 2016 at 21:38, Besnik Bleta <> wrote:

On 10/17/2016 05:12 PM, wrote:
> Dear Besnik,
> personally as a contributor with a strong focus in community growth I feel really uncomfortable
>(not to say offended) with your attitude towards people that I
personally know work so hard for the community.

Can you provide any example of "attitude" regarding <em>this</em>
community? And I haven’t express any about the people of <em>your</em>
community either. If I had an attitude, I wouldn’t have accepted 18,
eighteen, new people, into Albanian Fedora Translation team, I wouldn’t
have made the offer to transfer the administration of the whole project
to any of them capable, I could have simply bulk reject their
contribution in anaconda and elsewhere (they still are there, you scroll
only a couple of dozens of strings in top, only to find them ridden of
misspelling words. I have not even bother to look for logical errors,
consistency issues, misinterpretation, et cetera, et cetera…)

> I want to be clear here: you share only half of the information and it is obvious you are doing it intentionally.
>Just to clarify for the list: Jona, was the first to ask for the SQ
mailing list to be created after discussing it
>in one of our weekly meetings, which clearly shows the will to have all
the work documented there. You can find
>the request here
> You jumped to ask for admin rights right away (sadly using the fact that you knew were to ask for it as a more
> experienced user) and afterwards when Jona contacted you to become
also an admin of the list (her being the person
>who initiated the process) you declined because 'isn't it too early to
make such requests?' as mentioned in this email
> Now, how reasonable is to deny admin access to
someone who initiated the request for the mailing
>list in the first place I would like to leave it to the list to judge.

I haven’t hidden anything from what you stated above about the creation
of the mailing list. Your are dreaming about intentions here. And you
should know by now that you don’t give admin rights to unknown people,
people who just arrived, as it was the case with your protégée at that
time, while I’ve been the coordinator and the main contributor to Fedora
translations prior to even the foundation of the organization you

>I hope now the list understands why people in the community feel uncomfortable participating in the mailing list
and why they avoid it.

You’re again making assumptions here about how future participants could
have guessed--prior to their arrival to the list-- how easy or difficult
would be to participate, unless they have been biased to believe so. You
could go back to the list and try to find a case in which I made people
uncomfortable to participate in the translations. You’ll find none,
unless you count a couple of mails where I implored new members to get
rid of Hotmail email addresses and one about a inappropriate nickname!
(I think even those were personal mails, not sent through the list, but
I might be mistaken…)

> You were also wondering why people have not contributed in the last two months. Well Besnik, they have!
>They have been contributing in recruiting, planning events and working
with fellow Fedora community members,
> but they avoid localization not to be called 'primadona' or else.

I was not wondering. I referred what Zanata provides for the last two
months. In case you don’t know yet, Zanata is the platform for managing
Fedora translations. Extra-translational activities of any kind are
off-topic in this thread.

>You also do not accept the beneficial elements of crowd-editing
>and contributing (based on your communication through email, a concept accepted by almost all FLOSS communities.
I still don’t. I wanted to prove myself wrong though, that’s why I let
18 new contributors in (mainly recruted from your organization, it
seems). Zanata reports that I was right then, as far as Fedora sq
translations go.

> As it is right now: we have you, someone that has informed the community six month before that has no time to contribute
>and that promised that will step down if there are active contributors
(well Anxhelo has contributed more than you)
I’ve recognized his contribution in a previous mail to the locale list.
For the rest no comprehensive statistics (you might light to count my
contribution in Fedora website group of translations and elsewhere;
check them

>and on the other hand we have the people that are pushed away from localisation efforts. As i see it the sum here is zero.
>In my opinion we are working during the day to bring new contributors
and by night you do your best to send them away by
>declining almost everything is done because you don't agree with the
way we work on the hackerspace.

That’s not true either. I haven’t done any really reviewing since late
April and the reasons are stated over and over (my initial idea of
transferring the maintenance of the project to someone else).
Just because someone is able to register an account on Zanata doesn’t
make them automatically contributors.

> Besnik, I'd like to remind you that one of the four foundations of the Fedora Project is 'Friends' and you have proven not to be a good one.
>In the contrary, you have been a person that clearly does not want new
contributors to jump in the project.

I’d invite you to refrain from guessing. My actions prove you wrong here.

As per what I want, I won’t bother telling you that one more time. I
have done that enough in the past.

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