Hi all,
I have spent the last two days experimenting with Fedora 33 on a 2017 12" Macbook (Macbook10,1). Unlike some previous Macs I have installed Fedora on, out-of-the box peripheral support is fantastic. I didn't have to install a single driver myself, everything was included. /praise over
After reviewing our "dualboot with macOS" testcase [0], I noticed that the testcase says it's based on a Mac running macOS 10.12 Sierra. At this point in time, macOS Sierra is almost 5 years old. I would like to update this testcase to reflect that it supports *any* OS from macOS 10.12 Sierra to macOS 11 Big Sur. I have tested these myself for compatibility and find that they all provide the necessary means for a dualboot install.
On a side note, I would also like to include a small notice within the testcase that mentions that Fedora is *not* supported on the new Apple Silicon M1 computers and that this testcase only applies to Intel-based Macs.
I have made these changes as I see them to my own wiki page [1]. Please review the page and propose any suggestions here. Feedback is welcome. If I don't hear any major squawks in a week or so, I will merge the changes into the official Fedora QA wiki.
Geoff Marr IRC: coremodule
[0] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/QA:Testcase_dualboot_with_macOS [1] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Coremodule/QA:Testcase_dualboot_with_macOS
On Tue, Jan 19, 2021 at 12:55 PM Geoffrey Marr gmarr@redhat.com wrote:
After reviewing our "dualboot with macOS" testcase [0], I noticed that the testcase says it's based on a Mac running macOS 10.12 Sierra. At this point in time, macOS Sierra is almost 5 years old. I would like to update this testcase to reflect that it supports *any* OS from macOS 10.12 Sierra to macOS 11 Big Sur. I have tested these myself for compatibility and find that they all provide the necessary means for a dualboot install.
It's a teeny modification but you could make it macOS 10.13 High Sierra as the cutoff. There's a chunk of hardware for which 10.13 is the latest officially supported version. And also Apple only supports two current versions of macOS, which are now 10.15 and 11. The vast majority of macOS users upgrade within a year, so the bulk of the user base is on 10.15 and 11.
There is a Fedora Media Writer signing issue related to a macOS bug in 10.13, so I wouldn't fuss one bit if you want to make the test case, or at least for blocking purposes, 10.14 and higher.
On a side note, I would also like to include a small notice within the testcase that mentions that Fedora is not supported on the new Apple Silicon M1 computers and that this testcase only applies to Intel-based Macs.
Yep. I expect there's some bootloader and kernel work before Workstation aarch64 is ready and reliable on M1 macs.
I have made these changes as I see them to my own wiki page [1]. Please review the page and propose any suggestions here. Feedback is welcome. If I don't hear any major squawks in a week or so, I will merge the changes into the official Fedora QA wiki.
No objections.
Lurking around, I think kparal knows where it is, there's a write up I did about 4 years ago on how to get an "out of the box" setup on macOS without having to do a clean install. That is obsolete. It's based on Core Storage (Apple's logical volume manager), whereas since then Apple has abandoned that entire scheme in favor of a new file system, APFS, that integrates a volume manager. That write up is probably easily adapted for APFS - the use case is to get an exact out-of-the-box setup for back to back test installs without having to clean install macOS. If it's useful, I can help with a refresh.
On Tue, Jan 19, 2021 at 8:56 PM Geoffrey Marr gmarr@redhat.com wrote:
Hi all,
I have spent the last two days experimenting with Fedora 33 on a 2017 12" Macbook (Macbook10,1). Unlike some previous Macs I have installed Fedora on, out-of-the box peripheral support is fantastic. I didn't have to install a single driver myself, everything was included. /praise over
After reviewing our "dualboot with macOS" testcase [0], I noticed that the testcase says it's based on a Mac running macOS 10.12 Sierra. At this point in time, macOS Sierra is almost 5 years old. I would like to update this testcase to reflect that it supports *any* OS from macOS 10.12 Sierra to macOS 11 Big Sur. I have tested these myself for compatibility and find that they all provide the necessary means for a dualboot install.
On a side note, I would also like to include a small notice within the testcase that mentions that Fedora is *not* supported on the new Apple Silicon M1 computers and that this testcase only applies to Intel-based Macs.
I have made these changes as I see them to my own wiki page [1]. Please review the page and propose any suggestions here. Feedback is welcome. If I don't hear any major squawks in a week or so, I will merge the changes into the official Fedora QA wiki.
The changes look good to me. Thanks!
On Wed, Jan 20, 2021 at 4:45 AM Chris Murphy lists@colorremedies.com wrote:
It's a teeny modification but you could make it macOS 10.13 High Sierra as the cutoff. There's a chunk of hardware for which 10.13 is the latest officially supported version. And also Apple only supports two current versions of macOS, which are now 10.15 and 11. The vast majority of macOS users upgrade within a year, so the bulk of the user base is on 10.15 and 11.
There is a Fedora Media Writer signing issue related to a macOS bug in 10.13, so I wouldn't fuss one bit if you want to make the test case, or at least for blocking purposes, 10.14 and higher.
So you can't get FMW to run on 10.13 without workarounds? If the cutoff was set to 10.14, we wouldn't be able to utilize our old Mac Mini 2011 that we have for testing in Brno office. 10.13 is the latest Mac OS X we can get to it.
On Wed, Jan 20, 2021 at 1:45 AM Frantisek Zatloukal fzatlouk@redhat.com wrote:
On Wed, Jan 20, 2021 at 4:45 AM Chris Murphy lists@colorremedies.com wrote:
It's a teeny modification but you could make it macOS 10.13 High Sierra as the cutoff. There's a chunk of hardware for which 10.13 is the latest officially supported version. And also Apple only supports two current versions of macOS, which are now 10.15 and 11. The vast majority of macOS users upgrade within a year, so the bulk of the user base is on 10.15 and 11.
There is a Fedora Media Writer signing issue related to a macOS bug in 10.13, so I wouldn't fuss one bit if you want to make the test case, or at least for blocking purposes, 10.14 and higher.
So you can't get FMW to run on 10.13 without workarounds? If the cutoff was set to 10.14, we wouldn't be able to utilize our old Mac Mini 2011 that we have for testing in Brno office. 10.13 is the latest Mac OS X we can get to it.
Correct https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/issue/7902#comment-606878
Therefore I create USB sticks via other means.
I think there is a workaround Fedora could employ in the FMW signing process, but my recollection is it's a PITA and not really worth the effort, despite a bunch of hardware being abandoned to 10.13. I have a 2011 MacBook Pro that's also stuck on 10.13.
Thanks all for the input. I have modified the list of supported OS versions to only include the first and the last supported version, instead of explicitly listing each version. The changes have been merged into the test matrix.
Geoff Marr IRC: coremodule
On Wed, Jan 20, 2021 at 1:04 PM Chris Murphy lists@colorremedies.com wrote:
On Wed, Jan 20, 2021 at 1:45 AM Frantisek Zatloukal fzatlouk@redhat.com wrote:
On Wed, Jan 20, 2021 at 4:45 AM Chris Murphy lists@colorremedies.com
wrote:
It's a teeny modification but you could make it macOS 10.13 High Sierra as the cutoff. There's a chunk of hardware for which 10.13 is the latest officially supported version. And also Apple only supports two current versions of macOS, which are now 10.15 and 11. The vast majority of macOS users upgrade within a year, so the bulk of the user base is on 10.15 and 11.
There is a Fedora Media Writer signing issue related to a macOS bug in 10.13, so I wouldn't fuss one bit if you want to make the test case, or at least for blocking purposes, 10.14 and higher.
So you can't get FMW to run on 10.13 without workarounds? If the cutoff
was set to 10.14, we wouldn't be able to utilize our old Mac Mini 2011 that we have for testing in Brno office. 10.13 is the latest Mac OS X we can get to it.
Correct https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/issue/7902#comment-606878
Therefore I create USB sticks via other means.
I think there is a workaround Fedora could employ in the FMW signing process, but my recollection is it's a PITA and not really worth the effort, despite a bunch of hardware being abandoned to 10.13. I have a 2011 MacBook Pro that's also stuck on 10.13.
-- Chris Murphy _______________________________________________ test mailing list -- test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to test-leave@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/test@lists.fedoraproject.org
On Wed, Jan 20, 2021 at 4:45 AM Chris Murphy lists@colorremedies.com wrote:
On Tue, Jan 19, 2021 at 12:55 PM Geoffrey Marr gmarr@redhat.com wrote:
After reviewing our "dualboot with macOS" testcase [0], I noticed that
the testcase says it's based on a Mac running macOS 10.12 Sierra. At this point in time, macOS Sierra is almost 5 years old. I would like to update this testcase to reflect that it supports *any* OS from macOS 10.12 Sierra to macOS 11 Big Sur. I have tested these myself for compatibility and find that they all provide the necessary means for a dualboot install.
It's a teeny modification but you could make it macOS 10.13 High Sierra as the cutoff. There's a chunk of hardware for which 10.13 is the latest officially supported version. And also Apple only supports two current versions of macOS, which are now 10.15 and 11. The vast majority of macOS users upgrade within a year, so the bulk of the user base is on 10.15 and 11.
There is a Fedora Media Writer signing issue related to a macOS bug in 10.13, so I wouldn't fuss one bit if you want to make the test case, or at least for blocking purposes, 10.14 and higher.
Note that we're not talking about adjusting blocking decisions, this is just a testcase. The current release criterion is here and doesn't specify any exact versions: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fedora_34_Final_Release_Criteria#OS_X_dual_bo...
On a side note, I would also like to include a small notice within the
testcase that mentions that Fedora is not supported on the new Apple Silicon M1 computers and that this testcase only applies to Intel-based Macs.
Yep. I expect there's some bootloader and kernel work before Workstation aarch64 is ready and reliable on M1 macs.
I have made these changes as I see them to my own wiki page [1]. Please
review the page and propose any suggestions here. Feedback is welcome. If I don't hear any major squawks in a week or so, I will merge the changes into the official Fedora QA wiki.
No objections.
Lurking around, I think kparal knows where it is, there's a write up I did about 4 years ago on how to get an "out of the box" setup on macOS without having to do a clean install.
I guess it's available as a document on our team's external hard-drive which we use(d) for macOS re-provisioning. And that hard-drive is probably in a locker in our currently inaccessible RH office. Or perhaps Lukas Brabec or Frantisek Zatloukal have it in their home.
That is obsolete. It's based on Core Storage (Apple's logical volume manager), whereas since then Apple has abandoned that entire scheme in favor of a new file system, APFS, that integrates a volume manager. That write up is probably easily adapted for APFS - the use case is to get an exact out-of-the-box setup for back to back test installs without having to clean install macOS. If it's useful, I can help with a refresh.
I don't currently need those updated instructions, neither does Lukas Brabec (who usually run dual-boot tests on our Mac Mini), I believe, because our Mac Mini is old and still has the old macOS. If Geoff or anyone else wants to see the updated instructions, we can try to retrieve that document (perhaps I have it stored also elsewhere, I'd have to look), update it, and store it online somewhere on our wiki.
On Tue, Jan 19, 2021 at 8:56 PM Geoffrey Marr gmarr@redhat.com wrote:
After reviewing our "dualboot with macOS" testcase [0], I noticed that the testcase says it's based on a Mac running macOS 10.12 Sierra. At this point in time, macOS Sierra is almost 5 years old. I would like to update this testcase to reflect that it supports *any* OS from macOS 10.12 Sierra to macOS 11 Big Sur. I have tested these myself for compatibility and find that they all provide the necessary means for a dualboot install.
Yeah, seems reasonable to me, but I also see the point in Chris's remark to limit the scope to the two last versions of MacOS.
On a side note, I would also like to include a small notice within the testcase that mentions that Fedora is *not* supported on the new Apple Silicon M1 computers and that this testcase only applies to Intel-based Macs.
+1
I have made these changes as I see them to my own wiki page [1]. Please review the page and propose any suggestions here. Feedback is welcome. If I don't hear any major squawks in a week or so, I will merge the changes into the official Fedora QA wiki.
The testcase looks good to me. Thanks.
Geoff Marr IRC: coremodule
[0] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/QA:Testcase_dualboot_with_macOS [1] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Coremodule/QA:Testcase_dualboot_with_macOS _______________________________________________ test mailing list -- test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to test-leave@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/test@lists.fedoraproject.org
On Tue, Jan 19, 2021 at 8:56 PM Geoffrey Marr gmarr@redhat.com wrote:
Hi all,
I have spent the last two days experimenting with Fedora 33 on a 2017 12" Macbook (Macbook10,1). Unlike some previous Macs I have installed Fedora on, out-of-the box peripheral support is fantastic. I didn't have to install a single driver myself, everything was included. /praise over
After reviewing our "dualboot with macOS" testcase [0], I noticed that the testcase says it's based on a Mac running macOS 10.12 Sierra. At this point in time, macOS Sierra is almost 5 years old. I would like to update this testcase to reflect that it supports *any* OS from macOS 10.12 Sierra to macOS 11 Big Sur. I have tested these myself for compatibility and find that they all provide the necessary means for a dualboot install.
I have no objections to that testcase change. Listing macOS versions which the testcase has been validated to work with is a good thing. Thanks for your work.
On a side note, I would also like to include a small notice within the testcase that mentions that Fedora is *not* supported on the new Apple Silicon M1 computers and that this testcase only applies to Intel-based Macs.
Sure, good idea.
I have made these changes as I see them to my own wiki page [1]. Please review the page and propose any suggestions here.
To make the review more comfortable next time, please first copy the existing testcase contents to your personal space and save it *intact*, and only *then* start making changes in followup edits. That way it's easy to use the wiki history function to see a diff of what exactly changed. (Currently I have to compare two web pages side by side just with my eyes, and that's a nuisance;) ). Thanks.