On Thu, 2008-10-23 at 13:43 -0300, Luis Felipe Marzagao wrote:
I think this is an important issue. I must say it´s impressive how
Fedora has been changing and giving much more attention, on each
realease, to the needs of end-users. We don´t need to go very far. If we
compare FC5 and F10, we can see there are huge differences in terms of
end-user support. NetworkManager is one great example.
In many cases, Fedora is just the face for upstream software
development. Take GNOME as an example -- there is a project with a
strong opinion about user interface design and human interaction.
We're not adding much value on top of that, except to channel bugs back
to GNOME.
I think we need to be clear about which problems we can solve within
_this_ project.
Exactly! It's clear it's not in the project objective to alter upstream
software. And in fact I agree it shouldn't be!
Although this has been really nice, I think there are things to improve.
I´m always hiting on the same key when it comes to end-users. I know
Fedora cannot (and should not) go away from its objectives (which is the
very reason of its success), but paying attention to the end-user voice
should be added as one *serious* project objective also. I mean, side by
side with "smooth updates", "rapid evolution" and the other good Fedora
principles.
I don´t have any doubts about the quality of the software behind Fedora.
And I´m aware a lot of people don´t mind if Fedora has a lot of
end-users or not. And that´s what I think should be changed. Fedora
should seek for increasing the number of end-users. And that´s only
possible when it receives, with an open spirit, and put to
consideration, the end-users demands. I´m not saying it´s not done at
all. I´m only suggesting it should be added as a main goal.
I think we are safer leaving that goal to the upstream projects we adopt
from. Let us channel user experience back to GNOME, KDE, et al, and all
the smaller applications.
I do think that having something such as, "Grow quantity of consuming
end-users by focusing on their demands," is going to be at direct odds
with the rest of the project objectives. We cannot effectively test the
Yes, of course. Not so much to heaven, not so much to hell. Other goals
should not be replaced by this one. But I think this matter should be
taken into consideration more often. Otherwise the "voice of community"
balloon on Fedora logo would be just an idea without any concrete
results. Not all demands should be applied, but only those that
wouldn't hurt/break other Fedora objectives.
quality of the latest GNOME and KDE interface, for example, if we are
not willing to put it out there as-is and see what happens. If we feel
we need to "adjust" such software to match end-user demands directly, we
begin a very slippery process. It might appear successful at first, as
it is for other distros, but in the long run, it is a failing
proposition.
This is an evolutionary process. We need to *first* improve the quality
of tools that Fedora contributors use. We need to make it simple for
people who help in #fedora to file and track bugs, etc. As we have
success there, we can push those tools closer and closer to the edge
where the end-user lives.
- Karsten