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I've a modest proposal that consist in the merge of Fedora Ambassador and Fedora Marketing mailing lists. The reson of this is that i've see that many time the discussions are the same and it's seems to me as a redundant thing.
I think that if we want to work better we have to work togheter, put our power into something and be sure that is no lost time.
Yes, if we consider it we have to consider to open ambassadors list to non ambassador people (as marketing is). I think it will be a new step to improve the project giving all interested people to join the project and simplify the infrastructure.
Thanks
Francesco Ugolini
- -- http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FrancescoUgolini
Francesco Ugolini wrote:
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I've a modest proposal that consist in the merge of Fedora Ambassador and Fedora Marketing mailing lists. The reson of this is that i've see that many time the discussions are the same and it's seems to me as a redundant thing.
I think that if we want to work better we have to work togheter, put our power into something and be sure that is no lost time.
Yes, if we consider it we have to consider to open ambassadors list to non ambassador people (as marketing is). I think it will be a new step to improve the project giving all interested people to join the project and simplify the infrastructure.
With the large number of infrastructure changes associated with Fedora 7, we have recently started discussing the idea of reorganizing the mailing lists. See https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-advisory-board/2007-January/msg00104..... So instead of opening up ambassadors list, I think it might be better to just merge ambassadors list with marketing list here and just discuss everything in this list instead.
The original idea of ambassadors were contact points around events all over the world but that has substantially changed and increased the scope for the better over time. We opened up archives for ambassadors list a while back after my prodding. I think we are ready for a merge back now. Folks who want to be recognised as ambassadors can just follow the usual process. The rest of them marketing folks can continue discussing things here as usual. The advantage of this is that it gives us broader participation and visibility. Let me know what you guys think.
Rahul
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Rahul Sundaram ha scritto:
Francesco Ugolini wrote:
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I've a modest proposal that consist in the merge of Fedora Ambassador and Fedora Marketing mailing lists. The reson of this is that i've see that many time the discussions are the same and it's seems to me as a redundant thing.
I think that if we want to work better we have to work togheter, put our power into something and be sure that is no lost time.
Yes, if we consider it we have to consider to open ambassadors list to non ambassador people (as marketing is). I think it will be a new step to improve the project giving all interested people to join the project and simplify the infrastructure.
With the large number of infrastructure changes associated with Fedora 7, we have recently started discussing the idea of reorganizing the mailing lists. See https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-advisory-board/2007-January/msg00104..... So instead of opening up ambassadors list, I think it might be better to just merge ambassadors list with marketing list here and just discuss everything in this list instead.
The original idea of ambassadors were contact points around events all over the world but that has substantially changed and increased the scope for the better over time. We opened up archives for ambassadors list a while back after my prodding. I think we are ready for a merge back now. Folks who want to be recognised as ambassadors can just follow the usual process. The rest of them marketing folks can continue discussing things here as usual. The advantage of this is that it gives us broader participation and visibility. Let me know what you guys think.
Rahul
+1
- -- http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FrancescoUgolini
+1
On 1/8/07, Francesco Ugolini francesco.ugolini@fedoraproject.org wrote:
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Rahul Sundaram ha scritto:
Francesco Ugolini wrote:
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I've a modest proposal that consist in the merge of Fedora Ambassador and Fedora Marketing mailing lists. The reson of this is that i've see that many time the discussions are the same and it's seems to me as a redundant thing.
I think that if we want to work better we have to work togheter, put our power into something and be sure that is no lost time.
Yes, if we consider it we have to consider to open ambassadors list to non ambassador people (as marketing is). I think it will be a new step to improve the project giving all interested people to join the project and simplify the infrastructure.
With the large number of infrastructure changes associated with Fedora 7, we have recently started discussing the idea of reorganizing the mailing lists. See https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-advisory-board/2007-January/msg00104..... So instead of opening up ambassadors list, I think it might be better to just merge ambassadors list with marketing list here and just discuss everything in this list instead.
The original idea of ambassadors were contact points around events all over the world but that has substantially changed and increased the scope for the better over time. We opened up archives for ambassadors list a while back after my prodding. I think we are ready for a merge back now. Folks who want to be recognised as ambassadors can just follow the usual process. The rest of them marketing folks can continue discussing things here as usual. The advantage of this is that it gives us broader participation and visibility. Let me know what you guys think.
Rahul
+1
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-- Fedora-marketing-list mailing list Fedora-marketing-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list
On 1/8/07, Alex Maier lxmaier@gmail.com wrote:
+1
I think It's a very bad idea to merge contributors and users. The other mailing lists are being merged for a specific reason, core and extras are being merged. Here, there is a different use of these 2 mailing lists(ambassadors,marketing).
The ambassadors list is a mailing list intended for committed fedora contributors willing to help in marketing fedora and its projects. Whereas marketing list is the playground where we should encourage fedora users to propose/publish their comments.
Having a separate mailing list for ambassadors makes it a special project. People want to join that special group and in the end this creates man power for various linux events. Ambassadors list is where serious discussions (concerning events) are taken place. If anyone pokes in, it will be a real chaos.
Greg's dream of having Ambassadors spreading the fedora word might lose its quality.
Chitlesh
If lists are reorganised please make sure they all use the same mailman header patters
I have this on my procmailrc
:0 * ^Return-Path: <fedora(-|-(ambassadors|art|desktop|devel|extras|fr|marketing|trans|test|selinux)-)list-bounces@redhat.com> * ^List-Id:.*<fedora(-|-(ambassadors|art|desktop|devel|extras|fr|marketing|trans|test|selinux)-)list.redhat.com> * ^X-loop: fedora(-|-(ambassadors|art|desktop|devel|extras|fr|marketing|trans|test|selinux)-)list@redhat.com * ^X-BeenThere: fedora(-|-(ambassadors|art|desktop|devel|extras|fr|marketing|trans|test|selinux)-)list@redhat.com $FEDORA
Which unfortunately does not work for all Fedora lists.
On 1/8/07, Chitlesh GOORAH chitlesh@fedoraproject.org wrote:
On 1/8/07, Alex Maier lxmaier@gmail.com wrote:
+1
I think It's a very bad idea to merge contributors and users. The other mailing lists are being merged for a specific reason, core and extras are being merged. Here, there is a different use of these 2 mailing lists(ambassadors,marketing).
A bit of history here for all who's got a second to read this.
The Marketing list was created originally with the same idea in mind--to promote (market) Fedora. As the list was just a list, and did not have a governing body or a mission statement, it eventually became what it is now--a discussion forum, not a group that was able to accomplish goals. And that is what it still is.
When the time came, and deeds were asked, the Marketing list was not able to deliver, and the Ambassadors group was created.
Since then, the Ambassadors went on to accomplish a lot of stuff, and the Marketing list is still a list.
The question arises, what exactly is the point of the list, if most Ambassadors are its members and the only people who are empowered to take any action on whatever is discussed on the Marketing list?
The ambassadors list is a mailing list intended for committed fedora contributors willing to help in marketing fedora and its projects. Whereas marketing list is the playground where we should encourage fedora users to propose/publish their comments.
Please note that it is almost exactly the same group of people discussing on both lists. The Ambassadors group is a very open one, and hurdles to joining are extremely low--I think all interested parties (those who wish to contribute to Fedora by brainstorming "marketing" ideas) could be quite easily integrated into the Ambassadors group.
Having a separate mailing list for ambassadors makes it a special project. People want to join that special group and in the end this creates man power for various linux events. Ambassadors list is where serious discussions (concerning events) are taken place. If anyone pokes in, it will be a real chaos.
No users beyond this point please?
I strongly believe in openness and meritocracy. So far, we have 193 members in the Ambassadors group--pretty much enough people to create all the chaos you can take. And yet, we're pretty good at organizing ourselves and policing the few rules we have.
Inviting an additional hundred or two into the group will not make the project weaker. The Ambassadors are not a "special" force who preach onto the footfolk. We ARE the footfolk, we ARE the users, and if we are not ready to talk with the users and on their level, we have no reason and right to talk to them at all.
Greg's dream of having Ambassadors spreading the fedora word might lose its quality.
Greg had a dream... Oh well, let Greg correct me if I am wrong.
/me bows before Greg
On 1/8/07, Alex Maier wrote:
Inviting an additional hundred or two into the group will not make the project weaker. The Ambassadors are not a "special" force who preach onto the footfolk. We ARE the footfolk, we ARE the users, and if we are not ready to talk with the users and on their level, we have no reason and right to talk to them at all.
Not weaker, but it might affect quality. Many other projects envy us for that quality. Personally, I think Fedora Marketing hasn't got the love it should have got. The topic of "How Fedora 7 will be called" should happen in the Fedora Marketing List, for example.
Greg had a dream... Oh well, let Greg correct me if I am wrong.
/me bows before Greg
HAD a dream ? He has no longer that dream?
Chitlesh
Closed + Open dual list on the same topics is a very bad idea. People on the open list always end up suspecting dark designs are discussed on the closed list (see also: xfree86 debacle)
On 1/8/07, Alex Maier lxmaier@gmail.com wrote:
... I strongly believe in openness and meritocracy. So far, we have 193 members in the Ambassadors group--pretty much enough people to create all the chaos you can take. And yet, we're pretty good at organizing ourselves and policing the few rules we have.
A minor correction. We have 155 *verified* Fedora Ambassadors. :) http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ambassadors/MembershipService/Verification Regards,
Am Montag, 8. Januar 2007 22:05 schrieb Chitlesh GOORAH:
I think It's a very bad idea to merge contributors and users. The other mailing lists are being merged for a specific reason, core and extras are being merged. . . Greg's dream of having Ambassadors spreading the fedora word might lose its quality.
I Couldn't better say that.
Il giorno lun, 08/01/2007 alle 22.05 +0100, Chitlesh GOORAH ha scritto:
I think It's a very bad idea to merge contributors and users.
[cut]
The ambassadors list is a mailing list intended for committed fedora contributors willing to help in marketing fedora and its projects. Whereas marketing list is the playground where we should encourage fedora users to propose/publish their comments.
I'm with Chitlesh on this topic, all the way. +1 for _not_ merging
(and keep mails in the list in topic)
On Tue, 2007-01-09 at 01:07 +0530, Rahul Sundaram wrote:
Francesco Ugolini wrote:
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I've a modest proposal that consist in the merge of Fedora Ambassador and Fedora Marketing mailing lists. The reson of this is that i've see that many time the discussions are the same and it's seems to me as a redundant thing.
I think that if we want to work better we have to work togheter, put our power into something and be sure that is no lost time.
Yes, if we consider it we have to consider to open ambassadors list to non ambassador people (as marketing is). I think it will be a new step to improve the project giving all interested people to join the project and simplify the infrastructure.
With the large number of infrastructure changes associated with Fedora 7, we have recently started discussing the idea of reorganizing the mailing lists. See https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-advisory-board/2007-January/msg00104..... So instead of opening up ambassadors list, I think it might be better to just merge ambassadors list with marketing list here and just discuss everything in this list instead.
The original idea of ambassadors were contact points around events all over the world but that has substantially changed and increased the scope for the better over time. We opened up archives for ambassadors list a while back after my prodding. I think we are ready for a merge back now. Folks who want to be recognised as ambassadors can just follow the usual process. The rest of them marketing folks can continue discussing things here as usual. The advantage of this is that it gives us broader participation and visibility. Let me know what you guys think.
Rahul
+1
marketing@lists.fedoraproject.org