Continuing discussion from "Re: Web-Interface for packages in Fedora: repoview, repowatch, something else?" https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-devel-list/2007-July/msg01093.html
Nicolas Mailhot wrote:
Le Ven 20 juillet 2007 15:26, Jesse Keating a écrit :
All I'm doing is stating my opinions that I've developed over the years of dealing with java applications and hosting java services.
IMHO as soon as we get a working FLOSS JDK the various Red Hat/JBoss Java groups need to do get together a few days with Red Hat/Fedora distro/Infrastructure team representatives and hash up how Fedora/Red Hat Java can be made sysadmin-friendly.
As a sysadmin who deals with Java apps and services, off the top of my head I'd say the biggest headaches are:
--installing JDKs, which should go away with a Free IcedTea JPackage in Fedora --process and memory monitoring (which "java" process is 3109 again?) --runtime dependency resolution (building a /usr/share/java/ CLASSPATH vs devs bundling all their own jars) --custom startup scripts for local apps (tomcat has an OK init script) --duplication of effort between ant/maven build files and RPM spec files --authorization/authentication (tomcat realms vs unix groups, etc.) --system-config-securitylevel / iptables for RMI or java.net.* --on dev machines, updating eclipse (though we just started using the Jpackage'd RHEL4 SDK channel which seems pretty stable)
Fedora can't do anything about some of these, but providing a JDK once the IcedTea issues are resolved will be a big help. And that's waiting on Sun: http://article.gmane.org/gmane.comp.java.openjdk.distro-packaging.devel/57 Note: classpath.org is currently down, use http://iced-tea.org/ instead. If anyone has a lot of cycles, wouldn't it be great if ant's <rpm> task generated a spec with dependencies as well as built the RPMs? :)
Thanks, Joshua
On 7/23/07, Andrew Overholt wrote:
On Mon, 2007-07-23 at 11:24 -0700, Joshua Daniel Franklin wrote:
--on dev machines, updating eclipse (though we just started using the Jpackage'd RHEL4 SDK channel which seems pretty stable)
I'm interested in more details here if you can provide them.
Sure, not sure if you mean on the problem side or the RHEL SDK side. If you've used Eclipse, the problem should be pretty clear. There is an update manager, but it's slow and half the time it crashes if you've got a bunch of plugins (and we do). It's usually faster to download an entire new Eclipse bundle than use the updater.
The RHEL4 SDK has most of what we normally use, which is Eclipse + WTP / Tomcat 5.5 (for J2EE) + Subclipse. It installs with up2date or yum and works. It's the same trade-off as usual for RHEL, it's not the latest features but it's stable. Users can install Europa in their home directory if desired.
On Mon, 2007-07-23 at 13:55 -0700, Joshua Daniel Franklin wrote:
On 7/23/07, Andrew Overholt wrote:
On Mon, 2007-07-23 at 11:24 -0700, Joshua Daniel Franklin wrote:
--on dev machines, updating eclipse (though we just started using the Jpackage'd RHEL4 SDK channel which seems pretty stable)
I'm interested in more details here if you can provide them.
Sure, not sure if you mean on the problem side or the RHEL SDK side. If you've used Eclipse, the problem should be pretty clear. There is an update manager, but it's slow and half the time it crashes if you've got a bunch of plugins (and we do). It's usually faster to download an entire new Eclipse bundle than use the updater.
Okay, that's an upstream problem that's being addressed in 3.4.
The RHEL4 SDK has most of what we normally use, which is Eclipse + WTP / Tomcat 5.5 (for J2EE) + Subclipse. It installs with up2date or yum and works. It's the same trade-off as usual for RHEL, it's not the latest features but it's stable. Users can install Europa in their home directory if desired.
What's the "RHEL4 SDK" you speak of? RHDS? I didn't think JPackage provided any Eclipse packages other than ecj anymore.
Andrew
On 7/25/07, Andrew Overholt wrote:
What's the "RHEL4 SDK" you speak of? RHDS? I didn't think JPackage provided any Eclipse packages other than ecj anymore.
Yes, I'm sorry it is RHDS. By JPackage I just mean they have "jpp" tags, these are from RHN. Here's the description from the RELEASE-NOTES:
Red Hat Developer Suite 3 includes the following:
. Eclipse SDK version 3.2 . Eclipse C/C++ Development Tooling version 3.1 including a technology preview of GNU Autotools support . Plugins for using OProfile version 1.2.1 . PHPEclipse 1.1.8 . Eclipse Web Tools Platform 1.5 . Eclipse Modeling Framework 2.2 . Eclipse Graphical Editing Framework 3.2 . Eclipse Visual Editor 1.2 . Plugins for using Bugzilla version version 0.2.4 . Enhanced ChangeLog authoring features version 2.2.2
We were hoping that SOAP, especially WS-Security, would become more interoperable, but I guess that's dead so now we don't care so much about WTP 2.0 / Axis 2.0.
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Joshua Daniel Franklin