On Dec 10, 2014 10:47 AM, "Mike Pinkerton" <pselists@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
>
> On 10 Dec 2014, at 11:52, Jerry James wrote:
>
>> On Wed, Dec 10, 2014 at 6:27 AM, Maros Zatko <mzatko@redhat.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Yes, there is netinstall in the Server variant, I suppose it's not the same as
>>> Workstation one and (as a user) I'm getting pretty confused now :)
>>
>>
>> I'm getting kind of confused myself.  I want to grab an image to throw
>> onto an old machine for my kids to use.  I just want a desktop with a
>> web browser and a mail client.  Workstation isn't suitable; they
>> aren't developers (yet).  Server and Cloud are definitely right out.
>> I don't want a Live CD; I want to actually install.  (In the past,
>> installing from a Live CD left one with different defaults than an
>> install from DVD, so I've learned to avoid the Live CD.  Perhaps that
>> reflex is now wrong.)  I guess I could go with one of the spins, but I
>> don't see a GNOME spin anywhere.  Is there really no DVD image for a
>> generic GNOME desktop install?  Maybe I should make Kevin happy and
>> get the KDE spin. :-)
>>
>> Actually, the KDE, Xfce, LXDE, and Mate spins all seem likely to fit
>> my use case, but I'm very surprised that there isn't a GNOME
>> equivalent.  Or is there?  If there is, I can't tell from the
>> information on getfedora.org.  What are we recommending for people who
>> want to install a generic "access the Internet" type of environment
>> for non-techies?  None of the products obviously address that
>> audience.
>
>
> This issue has been addressed tangentially in the marathon "Workstation defaults to wide-open firewall" thread.
>
> As best I can tell from Matthew Miller's responses there, Fedora has abandoned that portion of its previous user base that was using Fedora as a general, secure by default, Gnome desktop OS.  Those users are no longer supported by any Fedora product.
>
> I also am trying to figure out how I can use Fedora going forward to support general desktop requirements for SMB office workers, creative types and others who have heretofore been using Fedora as a general, secure by default, Gnome desktop OS.  The only ideas I have come up with so far are:
>
> •  Install Fedora 20, update it, then fedup to "nonproduct" variant of Fedora 21; or
>
> •  Use the server net install to install a minimal system as a "nonproduct" variant of Fedora 21, and then install a long list of packages needed to convert it into a general desktop OS.
>
> I have not yet tested and don't know how practical either of those ideas is.
>
> My users are accustomed to Gnome, so I prefer not to change to one of the alternative desktop environment spins if there is an easy way forward with Gnome.
>
> --
> Mike Pinkerton
>

I have a lot of tools.  Mechanics tools, woodworking tools, electronics tools, plumbing tools, whatever.  I don't drive over to the nearest hardware store and buy whatever they have on the shelf that fits the general description of "saw" or "torque wrench" or "multimeter".  I do some research, find quality products, and usually end up with something targeted towards "professionals" or "contractors" or whatever.  I'm not going to compromise my standards because I encounter a product that isn't marketed for "occasional semi-skilled use".  

Friends and family (at least, those that don't think the same way) end up borrowing my tools, even when they already have a saw or nailer or whatever.  The tools they end up with just aren't as good.  Often, their grabbed-off-the-shelf tools break more easily and sooner, while mine operate reliably through hard use.  The experience is just more pleasant, the user more productive, the quality of the end product noticeably better.

An OS is also a tool.  You don't have to be a professional developer to enjoy the benefits of a product targeted for professional developers.  You don't have to choose your experience based on the target audience of some marketing copy.  If the product works for you, and works well, use it.  (Obligatory aside - if you are a professional developer, and you prefer an alternative DE, Fedora works for you too :)

--Pete