On Tue, 29 Jan 2019 at 05:42, Matthew Miller <mattdm@fedoraproject.org> wrote:
On Mon, Jan 28, 2019 at 06:41:26PM +0100, Miro Hrončok wrote:
> >This feels more like system-wide change…
> >Especially since you say that some extra packages will be retired.
> A very limited set. The distro as a whole should not be impacted by this.
> The retired packages are legacy cruft. And the important stuff that
> needs to be updated needs some motivation like this.

"This change needs to motivate other important stuff that we don't have
direct control over to change" seems like *exactly* the reason we ask for
system-wide changes to be filed earlier.

This is like the 4th system wide change this release which is coming in as a Self-Contained. Each time the developer thinks it is self-contained because it is just one  little thing, but on regards it turns into being a system-wide change. However because the two deadlines are one after the other, it means that this change is pushed out another 6 months where the 3-4 weeks between System-Wide and Self-Contained doesn't seem very long. Can we either:

1) Move System-Wide and Self-Contained proposal deadlines to be the same date and allow FESCO/etc determine if the proposal needs to be moved to SW or SC then?
2) Move Self-Contained deadline BEFORE System-Wide so that  if it is really  System-Wide move it to the correct category?
3) Add a re-evaluate deadline after the first two? This allows us to get an idea that "oh wait this is going to really mess things up and we need to push this out one release?" or other items

At the moment, I think pushing out removal of yum3 for Fedora31 doesn't make sense if there isn't enough python2 for it to be useful in Fedora30. However I also think this is a system-wide change because a lot of tools need time to test that they REALLY do support not having yum3 in them. 

Stephen J Smoogen.