Seeking new maintainer(s) for package(s)
by Jesse Keating
The previous maintainer of emacs and lsscsi has asked me to find new
maintainers for these packages. He is no longer able to devote any time
to Fedora and had unsubscribed from lists a while ago while on vacation.
If you are interested in taking over one or both of these packages in
Fedora, please contact me.
--
Jesse Keating
Fedora -- Freedom² is a feature!
identi.ca: http://identi.ca/jkeating
15 years, 4 months
OTRS and Fedora
by Jos Vos
Hi,
What is the reason that OTRS has been removed from Fedora since F8?
Thanks,
--
-- Jos Vos <jos(a)xos.nl>
-- X/OS Experts in Open Systems BV | Phone: +31 20 6938364
-- Amsterdam, The Netherlands | Fax: +31 20 6948204
15 years, 4 months
how to add fc10-update branch?
by Carl Byington
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I have a package (libpst) that I was building for f10 by:
cd fedora/$NAME/devel
cvs update
make new-sources FILES=$BALL
cvs commit -m "update to $VER"
make tag
make build
That worked to build dist-f10 packages, and of course it now builds a
dist-f11 package. What steps do I need to build an updated f10 package,
presumably going into something like dist-f10-updates-candidate that
can then be (eventually) fetched via yum update?
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15 years, 4 months
Feature proposal: New, Standard Documentation System
by Michael Cronenworth
Far too often I find myself looking for non-existent man pages, Google
results, or help menus in GNU/Linux software. What's the problem? There
is no single, reliable, standardized documentation system that is
universally accepted or appreciated. Yes, what I'm about to describe
should obsolete man, info, and all the other dozen "help" documentation
found in all the Fedora packages.
Problem case out of the way: Fedora should pioneer a GNU/Linux
documentation system that meets these criteria:
1. Lightweight
The entire system should not demand hundreds of megs of fonts,
images, or other non-reusable requirements. I'm looking at you texlive.
Recommendations: SQLite, ncurses, GTK. Existing toolkits; not new ones.
2. CLI and GUI front-ends
Allow users to be presented to a universal and familiar front-end no
matter where they are. The parts should also be separable so that, for
instance, if there is no X requirement in a said environment, the help
packages should not require QT, GTK, etc.
3. Universal formatting
Obvious criteria, however, application specific formatting should be
allowed as an optional addition after a standard format has been met.
4. Easy to use creation tools
It shouldn't take a programmer background to write help
documentation. Be it WYSIWYG tools or a simple XML-like (hey, or even
XML) language to create documentation pages.
5. Global access
You should be able to access any and all documentation for all
software through a single window, be it X or console, without having to
open the corresponding program.
Optional criteria:
1. Platform independence (for use on non-GNU/Linux systems)
Feel free to rip me apart. To me, and I'm sure most standard Linux
users, documentation for /any/ piece of software is a nightmare, even if
you are the original author. It should not be that way!
Regards,
Michael
15 years, 4 months
F11: OSS and pulseaudio conflict
by Warren Togami
I ran into an application yesterday that seemed to make pulseaudio
daemon fail. After a lot of digging, someone else realized that this
application was actually using OSS output. OSS currently grabs /dev/dsp
(provided by snd-pcm-oss), making it appear that pulseaudio has "failed".
OSS applications are so rare these days, I did not even consider that it
was using OSS. This is likely to be a rare but repetitive source of
confusion in the future.
Removing snd-pcm-oss makes /dev/dsp disappear (which is a good thing).
Even with /dev/dsp gone, padsp wrapper allows an OSS app to output to
pulseaudio. Only this isn't a good permanent solution because we do not
want LD_PRELOAD wrapping everything.
I think perhaps during F11 we should do the following:
1) alsa-plugins-pulseaudio seems to be the key package someone must
remove if they really want to disable pulseaudio on their system. This
package could ship a /etc/modprobe.d/blacklist-oss file listing
snd-*-oss modules. This way OSS comes back if pulseaudio is disabled.
2) If someone REALLY wants OSS mixed in their pulseaudio desktop, they
can use padsp. This should be documented loudly in release notes. This
is no different from F9 and F10.
3) Later make /dev/dsp redirection to pulseaudio permanent without LD
hacks with the proposed FUSD? What is the status of this?
Warren Togami
wtogami(a)redhat.com
15 years, 4 months
Unowned directories
by Ben Boeckel
Hi,
I did the following command to find unowned directories (edited from my actual
command to get rid of stuff like tmp that came up with lots of false-positives—
though it is quite possible there still are some here):
# rpm -q --whatprovides `find /{{,s}bin,boot,dev,etc,lib{,64},usr} -type d` |
grep -v -e .x86_64 -e noarch -e i386 -e i686 -e ppc
There were too many to consider doing a bug report for each, so I'm posting here
with the list I get on my machine to start. I got rid of things that seemed like
false positives (things under /tmp, /var/cache, and /dev/.udev). Is this
something for review-o-matic to handle and post about or should some other
service check for unowned directories and files on a clean system and send out
emails to fedora-devel-announce and CC maintainers of suspected owners (looking
at owners of files in the directory, sibling files)?
To start, on my machine, I got the following output:
file /lib/alsa is not owned by any package
file /lib/alsa/init is not owned by any package
file /etc/selinux is not owned by any package
file /etc/selinux/targeted is not owned by any package
file /etc/selinux/targeted/contexts is not owned by any package
file /etc/selinux/targeted/contexts/files is not owned by any package
file /etc/selinux/targeted/modules is not owned by any package
file /etc/selinux/targeted/modules/active is not owned by any package
file /etc/selinux/targeted/modules/active/modules is not owned by any package
file /etc/selinux/targeted/policy is not owned by any package
file /etc/hotplug.d is not owned by any package
file /etc/hotplug.d/usb is not owned by any package
file /etc/.sdp is not owned by any package
file /etc/.sdp/license is not owned by any package
file /etc/snmp is not owned by any package
file /etc/vga is not owned by any package
file /etc/xdg/menus/kde-applications-merged is not owned by any package
file /etc/.ibm is not owned by any package
file /etc/.ibm/registry is not owned by any package
file /boot/efi is not owned by any package
file /boot/efi/EFI is not owned by any package
file /boot/lost+found is not owned by any package
file /dev/snd is not owned by any package
file /dev/disk is not owned by any package
file /dev/disk/by-label is not owned by any package
file /dev/disk/by-uuid is not owned by any package
file /dev/disk/by-id is not owned by any package
file /dev/disk/by-path is not owned by any package
file /dev/input is not owned by any package
file /dev/input/by-path is not owned by any package
file /dev/raw is not owned by any package
file /dev/cpu is not owned by any package
file /dev/cpu/1 is not owned by any package
file /dev/cpu/0 is not owned by any package
file /dev/bsg is not owned by any package
file /dev/bus is not owned by any package
file /dev/bus/usb is not owned by any package
file /dev/bus/usb/002 is not owned by any package
file /dev/bus/usb/007 is not owned by any package
file /dev/bus/usb/006 is not owned by any package
file /dev/bus/usb/005 is not owned by any package
file /dev/bus/usb/001 is not owned by any package
file /dev/bus/usb/004 is not owned by any package
file /dev/bus/usb/003 is not owned by any package
file /dev/.udev is not owned by any package
file /dev/net is not owned by any package
file /dev/mapper is not owned by any package
file /dev/shm is not owned by any package
file /dev/pts is not owned by any package
file /net is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/redhat is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/sr@Latn is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/sr@Latn/LC_MESSAGES is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/ca@valencia is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/ca@valencia/LC_MESSAGES is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/uz@cyrillic is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/uz@cyrillic/LC_MESSAGES is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/twi is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/twi/LC_MESSAGES is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/default is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/default/LC_MESSAGES is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/xx is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/xx/LC_MESSAGES is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/gy is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/bt is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/pa is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ky is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ng is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/sd is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/pe is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/C is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ni is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/dj is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/cx is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/at is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/pw is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/bi is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/tv is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/lb is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/gd is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/zm is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ao is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ir is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/kg is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ci is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/sv is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/my is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/mo is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ly is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/st is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/sz is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/dm is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/gt is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/tm is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/id is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/mq is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/za is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/mc is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/nz is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/mv is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/li is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ro is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/mg is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ie is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/sa is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ga is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/kh is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/si is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ax is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/kr is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/gr is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/lt is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ls is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/bz is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/la is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/aw is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/va is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/km is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/to is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/fj is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/mh is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/tj is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ck is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/lc is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/bn is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/cn is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/nl is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/fo is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/td is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/kw is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/cl is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/dz is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/us is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/es is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/sc is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/er is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/nu is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/de is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/pk is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/vc is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/mt is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/pf is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/cz is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ht is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/sr is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/cd is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/tk is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/mm is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ma is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/so is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/lu is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/gq is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/fi is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/by is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/cv is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/cc is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/np is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ae is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/hk is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/dk is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/jo is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/tr is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/mr is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/hu is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/jp is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/hn is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/gi is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ve is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/mn is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/eh is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/al is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/me is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/gu is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/vu is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/gb is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ne is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/fk is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ai is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/zw is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/co is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/bf is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/bj is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/an is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/gl is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ye is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/se is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/kz is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ca is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/as is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/mu is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/au is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/pt is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/af is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/sy is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/fm is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/mw is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/bo is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ms is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/bg is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/om is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/th is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ch is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/rw is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/uz is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ad is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/sb is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/bh is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/gh is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/vi is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/cf is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/iq is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/hr is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ws is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ee is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/cr is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ag is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/tg is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/tn is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/fr is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/pg is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/py is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/sn is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/nr is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ec is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/in is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/pm is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/sg is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/bd is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/wf is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/sm is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/no is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/br is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/md is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/gp is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/bb is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/eg is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/lr is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ru is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/tw is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ua is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ar is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/vn is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/uy is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/bw is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/sk is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/bs is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ge is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/mz is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/rs is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/nc is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/tt is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/pl is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/il is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/am is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ki is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/gw is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/kp is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ml is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/pn is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/mk is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/tz is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/az is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/lk is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/na is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/mx is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/jm is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/qa is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/gm is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/nf is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/vg is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/lv is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/et is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ps is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ba is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/cy is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/bm is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/be is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ph is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ug is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/cg is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/cu is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/tp is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/gn is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/pr is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/kn is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/ke is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/do is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/cm is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/sh is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/is is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/tc is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/l10n/it is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/en_US@piglatin is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/en_US@piglatin/LC_MESSAGES is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/nds_DE is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/nds_DE/LC_MESSAGES is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/sp is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/sp/LC_MESSAGES is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/zh_TW.Big5 is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/zh_TW.Big5/LC_MESSAGES is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/zh_CN.GB2312 is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/zh_CN.GB2312/LC_MESSAGES is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/en_ZA is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/en_ZA/LC_MESSAGES is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/gos is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/locale/gos/LC_MESSAGES is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/maxima/5.15.0 is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/akonadi is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/akonadi/agents is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/selinux is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/selinux/packages is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/selinux/packages/BackupPC is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/idl is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/rhgb is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/xml/docbook is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/kde4/apps/konqueror/icons/oxygen is not owned by any package
file /usr/share/kde4/apps/konqueror/icons/oxygen/scalable is not owned by any
package
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15 years, 4 months
Feature proposal: Community Translation Tool
by Christoph Höger
Hi,
did you ever want to use fedora in your own Non-English language and saw
strings which where simple to translate floating around untranslated?
I did. The best example is packagekit-gui's update dialog which has a
'review' button which was translated into german for f10, but remained
untranslated in f9 although it was really easy to do.
Why did I not contact upstream/fedora bz with a translation? Well, look
how translation works for such simple strings (and normal users):
1. find out which package that string belongs to
2. download the source (and figure out how to do that)
3. edit that translation file in that weird format with that weird tool
and create a thing called a "patch"
4. send that patch to bz (have a registered account!)
The point is: Joe Average User will not even consider doing that! If he
considers creating a bz account he can read english and will not have a
very big problem understanding some untranslated strings here and
there.
I would like to make that process automagic by providing
a) a simple app that allows users to make a "one string" contribution
b) write a backend, that would store all proposals and update all .po
files fedora has on a regular basis and send the generated patches
upstream or to a fedora translator.
Those tools could be integrated in a way that users could poll on
translations on a "yeah, that sounds good" basis if there already exists
a translation. Also the client could be offered/configured based on the
locale selected at install time.
Any ideas why that should not work / starting points to implement?
Christoph
15 years, 4 months
Logout sound ever gonna be fixed?
by Mark
Hey,
There is a bug report for it here:
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=470266
That's there since just a few weeks but the issue itself is in
bugzilla several times and known for years now.
And i wonder what the status is with this. If it's so hard to get it
working then please just destroy the entire option to have a logout
sound in gnome at the first place. A feature that is in but broken is
kinda ugly.
And perhaps this info helps. When pulseaudio wasn't in gnome the
logout sound did work, but was already screwed! it just played a part
of the logout sound before getting cut off.
I hope anyone can give me some status on this bug. I really hope it
can be fixed for F11.
Thanx,
Mark
15 years, 4 months
My roadmap for a better Fedora
by Callum Lerwick
So, many pieces of this have been blabbed about by me and others
recently and in the past, but I think a lot of people aren't seeing the
big picture. I think it's time I fit it all together.
Problem: Fedora is buggy, and updates are rife with regressions.
Solution: We need more and wider testing.
Problem: We need more and wider testing. Why don't we get more testing?
Thw reason *I* don't go out of my way to test updates, is if there's a
regression, it's such a pain in the ass to get the system back to a
known good state and keep it that way, and report a bug. If it's a pain
in the ass for me, it's impossible for Aunt Tillie.
Solution:
1) Make it easy to report bugs. Bugzilla is complex, slow, and
inscrutable. We need to put a simpler layer on top of it. Reporting a
bug should require just a few clicks. It should automatically include
all the information needed for the bug report, the distro version,
package version, arch, and things such as how the Xorg team demands your
xorg.conf and Xorg.0.log. Make finding dupes easier. Collect stack
traces system wide and enter them in a database, which bugzilla can
reference and from which bugzilla bugs can be derived. A system wide
kerneloops. (I know this has been talked about, what's the status?)
2) Make it simple to roll back to a known good state. We need a "system
restore". I know what you're thinking, but our vastly superior,
centralized, system-wide package management (and lack of a whole
seperate "system registry" namespace) allows us to make this actually
work. We need per-package rollback. Period.
3) Make it so yum will refuse to upgrade the package rolled back in step
2 until the bug reported in step 1 is fixed.
4) For when things go really wrong, we need a rescue image in /boot. All
the above functionality must be available inside the rescue environment.
5) So how do bugs get fixed? Make it easy to cherry pick updates from
updates-testing or even direct from bodhi. How useful is it to blindly
follow every update in updates testing? For most users, it's useless.
Such adventurous people should probably just run rawhide... What we
really need is to make it easy to pick a specific release of an update
to try, such as if a user is directed to in a bug report. A user should
just be able to click on a link given in the bug report and have the
update installed. Available updates and the reasons for them needs to be
more discoverable. Don't forget step #2.
See how these things build upon and support each other?
Notice here I'm talking purely about user interface, about the end user
experience. The technical infrastructure follows from this, and I'll
save that discussion for another message. Infrastructure supports
functionality, not the other way around. I don't want to hear any "Oh
but we can't do this because blah blah technical objection blah makes
this hard". I hereby dub this the "Hard problem fallacy". Engineers
solve hard problems, that's what we do. I want to hear "To do this we
need to do x y z". The only objections I will accept are of the form
"You are an idiot and your ideas are stupid. We're not doing this."
I should probably put this on the Wiki so it doesn't get lost...
15 years, 4 months