Hi,
On 05-07-17 15:46, Eric Griffith wrote:
The real question, however, Hans is: WHY do the tools care? And why
do we care? There's innumerable situations where the clock couldn't become out of
sync-- either forwards or backwards. Suppress the warnings and move on; is there any
situation where those warnings are actually helpful or relevant beyond a "huh, my
cmos battery died"?
We care because various tools care. Why the tools care? That is a good
question, you could search for past bugs about this to make an
initial list of affected tools and start a discussion with the
maintainers of those tools.
Regards,
Hans
>
>> On Jul 5, 2017, at 09:12, Hans de Goede <hdegoede(a)redhat.com> wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>>> On 05-07-17 11:30, Bastien Nocera wrote:
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> Hi,
>>>>
>>>>> On 04-07-17 16:41, Bastien Nocera wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>> On Tue, Jul 4, 2017 at 2:11 AM, Hans de Goede
<hdegoede(a)redhat.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> "Language and Keyboard Layout"
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I don't see how a normal (non live) non net-install
differs
>>>>>>> from a net-install. In both cases anaconda is pretty much
the
>>>>>>> only thing which is running and as such is the best place to
>>>>>>> ask about this. I agree that with livecds we need something
>>>>>>> else.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It doesn't. Anaconda is the right place in both cases. But
Workstation
>>>>>> has only the live image and netinstall images, so we don't
consider
>>>>>> this case.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "Time and Date"
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It is important to get the timezone setup correctly *before*
>>>>>>> running the phase of anaconda where it formats filesystems
>>>>>>> and copies files. Otherwise various tools may complain about
>>>>>>> timestamps in the future for files created during install
>>>>>>> time when the timezone is later changed in such a way
>>>>>>> that the (timezone-adjusted) time becomes earlier.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> We've had several bugs related to this in the past and
>>>>>>> actually have moved timezone configuration up to an earlier
>>>>>>> point in the installer because of this.
>>>>>
>>>>> The timezone configuration is only needed for dual-boot installations
where
>>>>> the BIOS is in local time instead of UTC, as I don't expect the
installer
>>>>> to write anything but UTC dates on disk.
>>>>
>>>> The problem is with freshly generated files, if the timezone is say
>>>> CET, then those files (and also the filesystem creation timestamp in
>>>> the superblock) get created at UTC+1, if then after boot the user
corrects
>>>> the timezone to say UTC-6 and within those 7 hours reboots the user
>>>> will get a bunch of complaints from fsck and other tools about
timestamps
>>>> in the future. IIRC. esp. the fsck issue was nasty.
>>> Why is the superblock creation date in local time instead of UTC?
>>
>> It is in UTC, but if localtime is say 5:00 and the timezone is
>> UTC - 5 then the superblock creation time will be 10:00 UTC
>>
>> If the user then after booting the install corrects the timezone
>> to UTC + 1 and then reboots then the superblock timestamp translates
>> to 11:00 while localtime is still 5:xx and we get an error about
>> the timestamp being in the future.
>>
>>>> Really this is a solved problem for 8 years or so now, the anaconda team
>>>> has gone over this in much detail back then. We simply MUST ask for the
>>>> timezone info before writing anything to disk.
>>> If we took that approach to every problem, I'd be on the beach right
now.
>>
>> See above, there really is nothing else we can do here.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Hans
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