On Mon, Jul 31, 2017, at 11:01 AM, buergermeister@karl-tux-stadt.de wrote:

Hi,

Sorry for the late answer but I was a bit busy last week.


Am 25.07.2017 um 05:17 schrieb Brian Exelbierd:
Sirko (and everyone),

I've been reading your multi-part series on how you're doing the F26
release party in Phnom Penh. 

I think this is a fantastic idea.  I like that you are working directly
with lots of future members of the IT working groups in Cambodia and
likely future contributors.  I really appreciate how using Fedora as a
base has let you talk about all kinds of technology and firmly introduce
it.  Students are a hard audience, and it seems like you've found a
great low-resource high energy way to engage them.  This is awesome. 
Keep your posts coming.

I think these kind of release parties create an opportunity for existing
contributors and ambassadors to really bond with potential community
members.  Many of our activities don't seem to have obvious followup.  I
would be surprised if there isn't clear followup by Sirko here as he
will obviously have invested a lot of time and made friends (by showing
off freedom, features and first).  What other ideas could we do like
this in your region?

yes there was a lot of time investment, the organizing of it started last year in May/June as I was first time at PNC for discussing their curriculum. The curriculum was changed since then, e.g. is now CENTOS used for teaching Linux basics instead of SLES. We had several meetups, what I in my Fedora role could do to support PNC in their process to get the students ready for their later role.
There will be another more Fedora oriented workshop, where we talk more about Fedora itself. The students know already the relationship Fedora has to CENTOS and looking forward to it. But so far the "Release Party" part is not finished yet. I still have to write a post about the Saturday and there are follow ups, every student did get a questionaire where I have received right now 28/50 after we received all and evaluated them, I will have another meeting with John Munger as head of PNC and Benoit Pitet to make an judgement, if we will do this in future again and where we been good with and where we can do better. So far we have a good feeling, as we made a short round after the party itself. There is another positive outcome, PN has not just a branch in Cambodia they have also one in Da Nang/Viet Nam and Cebu/Philippines so we might do it there in the future to, but lets see.

So it was highly time consuming what I did (and still havent finished yet) but here are all things more time consuming as in Europe or America.

If you want to help the region, then tell some first of all to realize the geographical size of it. They shall take an old atlas and cut out the Philippines and put it over Europe and the same they can do with Indonesia and put it over US. Maybe then they realize a bit of the dimensions and time zone problem we have here and stop to think its totally easy here to organize ONLINE IRC MEETINGS. Not speaking that even a rich country like Singapore has sometimes electricity problems ;)

While I intended my question to be a general one to prompt all ambassadors to think, I appreciate your answer as it raises awareness of some of the logistical challenges in APAC.

I think that working with FAmSCo we can find that there are a lot of ideas that could be put into place.  In particular, I know that @robyduck is working on some ideas that could help here too.

Let's get creative on how we can make this work.  This means what can we change to get a functioning system without destroying our ability to operate.  As someone "on the ground" your ideas are critical here.

Time is the biggest issue here, everything costs a lot of time and you have also lesser time. Brian I told you back at FUDCon, Asia would need an Impact by itself. The people have lesser time here to organize things but they are willing to contribute and participate.\

I do not believe that time is a unique problem for APAC.  I'd argue every region has its own version of this problem.  However, I don't understand why longer planning cycles and the like are insufficient here.  Can you expand on this?

I remember a discussion with Jeroen and Tuan about motivation of Asians, Tuan and I did not agree that they have to be motivated, they do everything with a lot of passion but organizing things they have a problem with, they lack on expierience for doing it and the time to do it. So the job for this Impact is to organize with the help of the locals, local events.

When I am approached with similar questions in other regions, my gut response is to start with the suggestion from the person closest to the culture/region in question and then "work out."  In this case, I think a discussion about motivation is less relevant than your second sentence.  We should always be working with local contributors and non-contributors.  This is a general answer that applies in most scenarios.  If we try to do all the work on our own our ambassadors (and by extension the whole project) will just burn out.

We have also get rid of the thinking that they will be the same kind of contributors as we currently have in other parts of the world. Here we will have more an amount of people that will join an hackfest or sprint. Forget about any idea to that ONLINE, it will not work.

I disagree completely.  I think there are bright people everyone.  They may have, as your point out, different modalities, but I refuse to believe we can't have a contributor everywhere.  If, as you say, no one in Cambodia will do online participation, then we may need to look at defering action in Cambodia until we know what we want to do that either helps people join our online community or how we are going to bridge offline and online.  I'd like to see answers to this before we just start a parallel program to create an isolated community.  Fedora is driven in part by "network effect."

Why question yourself, why I never did hear from Yekleang Dy, did she really start with the Web Team? The answer is no, why she doesnt know what IRC is, not what is SSH and and and.... They have a problem to learn such things by themself, they need somebody next to them with an idea, what it is. Therefore you do here better FAD, hackfests and sprints or do you expect me to go to each potential contributor and do it personally? Can do that, send me a cheque for my living costs ;)

If you don't want to organize the events for Fedora then you are not obligated to do so.  You volunteered for this role and you are free to leave it at any time.  However, I know that we have success stories around the world where people are organizing those kinds of events.  In fact, I think we could all work together to write a good curriculum to use for these kinds of events.  These will be people and time commitments of the project, but they don't have to be expensive in dollars.

But first of all this region needs more attention at all and a changing in thinking of some people. I give you an example, your budget changes created a lot of uncertainty here in APAC what leads to that no money is spent and the activity of all here broke down. So when in future the council or FPL wants to make changes in the budgeting or similar things, come up with a clear plan and not say, we will tell you later.....

The council has realized that it did not communicate its message as clearly as intended and we have been taking steps to fix that.  The LATAM ORG FAD included me solely for this reason.  LATAM doesn't need my help to organize, but it was a great opportunity for me to help convey the council's message.  We can do this for APAC in the form that makes the most sense.

I think that trying to pin the struggles of APAC on the budget is merely covering up larger challenges, challenges you mention earlier.

Here its anyway more complicated to do things strategically and plan events long ahead, thats why APAC always has the problem spending his budget as planned. If you did read my post I already complained about it. You really commit here sometimes a lot of time in an event and then it doesnt happen and of course Asian dont blog about that, only success stories ;) We will not change that, they seeing that as a failure and telling that in public means they loose their face.

I need your help in understanding how we can work on this.  You seem to be saying that there is a) not enough time; b) things move slowly; and c) planning over a longer horizon fails.  I don't think I am understanding you.

I know that India and China have both had successes.  Can we use those ideas to help other countries?  Should we start by focusing on the areas of success and not spread ourselves so thin?

Can you figure out what events are successful in your region and lets copy their planning process.

There are ideas for more events, also in the region and not just local, but in the current atmosphere Fedora is in, I will not do.

This is very much your right.  I am sure your contributions will be missed.  I am sorry to see that you are choosing to no longer be a Fedora Ambassador.  I am sure that FAmA can help you get delisted.  Should you choose to rejoin the Ambassador community I am sure you would be welcome.  If you want to contribute more ideas, I encourage you to work with the regional ambassadors.

regards,

bex


br gnokii

If you haven't read it, read it now:
http://karl-tux-stadt.de/ktuxs/?p=4958

regards,

bex
_______________________________________________
ambassadors mailing list -- ambassadors@lists.fedoraproject.org
To unsubscribe send an email to ambassadors-leave@lists.fedoraproject.org


_______________________________________________
ambassadors mailing list -- ambassadors@lists.fedoraproject.org
To unsubscribe send an email to ambassadors-leave@lists.fedoraproject.org