On Mon, Jul 31, 2017, at 11:01 AM, buergermeister(a)karl-tux-stadt.de wrote:> Hi,
Sorry for the late answer but I was a bit busy last week.
Am 25.07.2017 um 05:17 schrieb Brian Exelbierd:
> Sirko (and everyone), I've been reading your multi-part series on how you're
doing the F26 release party in Phnom Penh. I think this is a fantastic idea. I like that
you are working directly with lots of future members of the IT working groups in Cambodia
and likely future contributors. I really appreciate how using Fedora as a base has let
you talk about all kinds of technology and firmly introduce it. Students are a hard
audience, and it seems like you've found a great low-resource high energy way to
engage them. This is awesome. Keep your posts coming. I think these kind of release
parties create an opportunity for existing contributors and ambassadors to really bond
with potential community members. Many of our activities don't seem to have obvious
followup. I would be surprised if there isn't clear followup by Sirko here as he will
obviously have invested a lot of time and made friends (by showing off freedom, features
and first). What other ideas could we do like this in your region?>
yes there was a lot of time investment, the organizing of it started last year in
May/June as I was first time at PNC for discussing their curriculum. The curriculum was
changed since then, e.g. is now CENTOS used for teaching Linux basics instead of SLES. We
had several meetups, what I in my Fedora role could do to support PNC in their process to
get the students ready for their later role.> There will be another more Fedora
oriented workshop, where we talk more about Fedora itself. The students know already the
relationship Fedora has to CENTOS and looking forward to it. But so far the "Release
Party" part is not finished yet. I still have to write a post about the Saturday and
there are follow ups, every student did get a questionaire where I have received right now
28/50 after we received all and evaluated them, I will have another meeting with John
Munger as head of PNC and Benoit Pitet to make an judgement, if we will do this in future
again and where we been good with and where we can do better. So far we have a good
feeling, as we made a short round after the party itself. There is another positive
outcome, PN has not just a branch in Cambodia they have also one in Da Nang/Viet Nam and
Cebu/Philippines so we might do it there in the future to, but lets see. >
So it was highly time consuming what I did (and still havent finished yet) but here are
all things more time consuming as in Europe or America. >
If you want to help the region, then tell some first of all to realize the geographical
size of it. They shall take an old atlas and cut out the Philippines and put it over
Europe and the same they can do with Indonesia and put it over US. Maybe then they realize
a bit of the dimensions and time zone problem we have here and stop to think its totally
easy here to organize ONLINE IRC MEETINGS. Not speaking that even a rich country like
Singapore has sometimes electricity problems ;)
While I intended my question to be a
general one to prompt all ambassadors to think, I appreciate your answer as it raises
awareness of some of the logistical challenges in APAC.
I think that working with FAmSCo we can find that there are a lot of ideas that could be
put into place. In particular, I know that @robyduck is working on some ideas that could
help here too.
Let's get creative on how we can make this work. This means what can we change to get
a functioning system without destroying our ability to operate. As someone "on the
ground" your ideas are critical here.
Time is the biggest issue here, everything costs a lot of time and
you have also lesser time. Brian I told you back at FUDCon, Asia would need an Impact by
itself. The people have lesser time here to organize things but they are willing to
contribute and participate.\
I do not believe that time is a unique problem for
APAC. I'd argue every region has its own version of this problem. However, I
don't understand why longer planning cycles and the like are insufficient here. Can
you expand on this?
I remember a discussion with Jeroen and Tuan about motivation of
Asians, Tuan and I did not agree that they have to be motivated, they do everything with a
lot of passion but organizing things they have a problem with, they lack on expierience
for doing it and the time to do it. So the job for this Impact is to organize with the
help of the locals, local events.
When I am approached with similar questions in
other regions, my gut response is to start with the suggestion from the person closest to
the culture/region in question and then "work out." In this case, I think a
discussion about motivation is less relevant than your second sentence. We should always
be working with local contributors and non-contributors. This is a general answer that
applies in most scenarios. If we try to do all the work on our own our ambassadors (and
by extension the whole project) will just burn out.
We have also get rid of the thinking that they will be the same kind
of contributors as we currently have in other parts of the world. Here we will have more
an amount of people that will join an hackfest or sprint. Forget about any idea to that
ONLINE, it will not work.
I disagree completely. I think there are bright people
everyone. They may have, as your point out, different modalities, but I refuse to believe
we can't have a contributor everywhere. If, as you say, no one in Cambodia will do
online participation, then we may need to look at defering action in Cambodia until we
know what we want to do that either helps people join our online community or how we are
going to bridge offline and online. I'd like to see answers to this before we just
start a parallel program to create an isolated community. Fedora is driven in part by
"network effect."
Why question yourself, why I never did hear from Yekleang Dy, did she
really start with the Web Team? The answer is no, why she doesnt know what IRC is, not
what is SSH and and and.... They have a problem to learn such things by themself, they
need somebody next to them with an idea, what it is. Therefore you do here better FAD,
hackfests and sprints or do you expect me to go to each potential contributor and do it
personally? Can do that, send me a cheque for my living costs ;)
If you don't
want to organize the events for Fedora then you are not obligated to do so. You
volunteered for this role and you are free to leave it at any time. However, I know that
we have success stories around the world where people are organizing those kinds of
events. In fact, I think we could all work together to write a good curriculum to use for
these kinds of events. These will be people and time commitments of the project, but they
don't have to be expensive in dollars.
But first of all this region needs more attention at all and a
changing in thinking of some people. I give you an example, your budget changes created a
lot of uncertainty here in APAC what leads to that no money is spent and the activity of
all here broke down. So when in future the council or FPL wants to make changes in the
budgeting or similar things, come up with a clear plan and not say, we will tell you
later.....
The council has realized that it did not communicate its message as
clearly as intended and we have been taking steps to fix that. The LATAM ORG FAD included
me solely for this reason. LATAM doesn't need my help to organize, but it was a great
opportunity for me to help convey the council's message. We can do this for APAC in
the form that makes the most sense.
I think that trying to pin the struggles of APAC on the budget is merely covering up
larger challenges, challenges you mention earlier.
Here its anyway more complicated to do things strategically and
plan events long ahead, thats why APAC always has the problem spending his budget as
planned. If you did read my post I already complained about it. You really commit here
sometimes a lot of time in an event and then it doesnt happen and of course Asian dont
blog about that, only success stories ;) We will not change that, they seeing that as a
failure and telling that in public means they loose their face.
I need your help in
understanding how we can work on this. You seem to be saying that there is a) not enough
time; b) things move slowly; and c) planning over a longer horizon fails. I don't
think I am understanding you.
I know that India and China have both had successes. Can we use those ideas to help other
countries? Should we start by focusing on the areas of success and not spread ourselves
so thin?
Can you figure out what events are successful in your region and lets copy their planning
process.
There are ideas for more events, also in the region and not just
local, but in the current atmosphere Fedora is in, I will not do.
This is very much
your right. I am sure your contributions will be missed. I am sorry to see that you are
choosing to no longer be a Fedora Ambassador. I am sure that FAmA can help you get
delisted. Should you choose to rejoin the Ambassador community I am sure you would be
welcome. If you want to contribute more ideas, I encourage you to work with the regional
ambassadors.
regards,
bex
br gnokii
> If you haven't read it, read it now:
>
http://karl-tux-stadt.de/ktuxs/?p=4958 regards, bex
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